00:00:01 Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, welcomed episode number thirty two The Hunting Collective. I'm Ben O'Brien, and today I am joined by very special guests and a very important guest, and his name is Senator John Tester. He's a Democrat from state of Montana and he's currently running for re election against Matt Rosendale. And this is, you know, for me, just uh what I believe is relatively normal guy to be able to sit down with somebody like John Tester and talk about the issues that I'm that I feel like are important to me and important to do you all listening, Um was fantastic and it was a privilege. I found Senator Tester be straightforward and we talked before and after the podcast about very uh important issues. I mean obviously has limited time this time of year to chat, but um, I found it to be credible and believable and firm handshake and look you straight the eye and speak about what he believes. And so whether you agree or disagree with some of the things he'll say in the podcast upcoming, I hope you listen with an open mind and m and learn more about his stance on public lands, his stance on chronic wasting disease, his stance on mining and astraction on his lands of Montana, and really just why he loves the state where he was born. So, without further ado, please welcome Senator John Tester. Senator Tester, thanks for joining me. It's great to be here. Thanks for you. Snowy Montana. It's uh it's fall in Mintiana and uh you Spring used to be my favorite time here. But I guess maybe it's with age you gravitate towards fall, because I just love the fall after a hot summer, you got the air's crisp. You know, it's pretty cool, and you know winner is coming. So if you're gonna live in Montana, I find you gotta love the winner. Yeah, no, I mean it is. I mean winners aren't like they used to be when I was a kid. You know, when we'd have thirty below for weeks on end and you were stuck in the house. And yeah, it's now. But I will say one thing. Last winter we had a good winner here, first one since seventy eight, and it makes you appreciate spring when it comes. But I gotta tell you, I love the winner as long as as long as you don't have to be somewhere because you never know if the wind blows, the roads are closed, so you've got a kind of plan ahead. But it's a you know, montan is a great state because of the four seasons, because of our public lands, because of our ability to go out get there like and or whatever you need. But but but but it is. I mean, I was you know, I've been able to get all over the country as the U. S. Senator. And uh, and there's no other place like Montana on the lower forty eight. I'll just tell you that. Um uh, you know, Alaska's marvelous, but it's not lower forty eight. That's all the bandings will take it. No, I mean, I'm just moving here. And um, as somebody likes to go outside, there is moving here. People speak differently about going outside. Yeah, Levin living in Texas and I'm from the East Coast. Originally people speak differently about going outside. Their eyes light up when you talk about a certain canyon or a place. Everybody shares that we can all go if we want to. And so it's just a different way to interact about going outside. And and part of it is and at least from my my perspective, part of it is is is public lands. Part of it is as a block management programs that we set up at the state level where you don't have to be a millionaire to be I'll be able to access some unbelievable places, whether it's for hunting, whether it's for fishing, whether it's for just going out and running up and down on mountains without your cell phone working, you know. Right. It's uh, it's because of that ability to and it's and and it's also because I might add, and this is changing, and it's changing pretty rapidly of of the ranchers willingness to let on hunters to help manage the game. Um. But but you know, we've always had a strong tradition in this state of of um, you know, being able to get out there and uh, you know, on harvesting deer, elk, or catch a few fish, whatever you might be. Yeah, I mean, when I was thinking about this conversation, my first question that paying the mind is that you seem like a pretty easy going uh you know, you know, wheat farmer from big sandy and small town Like why uh, you know, the political why jump into the political pressure cooker, Why take you know, take your life the way you have and and stand up for what you believe. I mean, I know it's not an easy gig. I can I can just tell you that we've got a pretty good life on the farm. I mean, we do that. We we've we've farmed the land. My grandmother and father homestead and my folks farmed it. It's an incredible honor, special in this day and age because there's not many folks who have that opportunity. But but it's also a time when you know, my my grandmother passed away when I was sixteen. My grandmother was a political animal. And so when we'd go have dinner at my grandmother's house when I was in grade school and junior high and early early high school years, I talked a lot of politics. I mean talked a lot about who was doing this, you know at that moment time the Kennedy years, L B. J. Nixon and uh, and they talked a lot about what was going on. And and my grandmother was smart. She immigrated here from Sweden when she was sixteen, um and never went back, which is always amazing to me. But but she was smart, I mean whip smart, and and she uh, she just osmosis. I guess got me involved. My mother kind of fell off of her her her her standard there. And my mother was very, very very in tune with what was going on. She read a normal amounts of information about what's going on. So long story short, I'm a junior in high school. We go to the state legislature. They pack up all the juniors and seniors. It was nineteen seventy three. Jumped on the bus. Never been to the state capitol before in my life. We talked politics, but we never did go to see the legislature. Work had a chance to do it through our school district and walked in and got to meet some of the folks that you know represent me in Big Sandy, Montana, and and saw that beautiful building that we have in Montana called our state capital. And I said to myself, and this is gonna sound corny, but it's absolutely a fact. I said, one of these days, if I get a chance, I want to do this. And um, we talked to him there. They were good people, the senators and the House members that were there. And in my neighbor who who was a different political party me, but he was a very very good friend. And I was never going to run against him, decided not to run for re election. And I told my my wife, you know what, my daughter was just graduating from high school and my son was just going into seventh grade. It wasn't the ideal time to run for the legislature. But if we were't gonna do it now, we'll probably never do it. And so I did it. And one thing led to another and ended up in the US. Here we are, um and and not only are you a farmer there, but you've got a bit of a butcher's shop there. Yeah, we do. Look it's it's not a huge farm. So dad, in the in the fifties actually started cutting meat to help supplement the income. And uh, and so you know, as he said, I didn't have any change in my pocket when I went to town, and so uh he started cutting meat, and one thing and into another, and then he end up building the shop in the early sixties and and cut me till he retired in seventy eight. I taught school coming out of college, and in the spring and the fall of seventy eight, and I couldn't make enough money to put tires on the car, and people were asking me to cut meat. So my wife and I started the butcher shop and me ran it till I got into the state legislature. Yeah, I mean, I think the things that you're talking about when you describe your life, your early life and and even your current life, is a lot around values, like what what values your grandparents and your parents instilled in you, and then what values that you hold to be Montana values. So give us a quick overview of of your you know, your boiler plate on what's Montana values? What's that mean when you take that to d C. Well, I mean, I'll just tell you. Your word is your bond. Your handshake makes something that means something. You don't you look somebody and I are telling me you're gonna do it. You don't need a written contract to do it. That's the way it's gonna be. And uh, in agreements, in agreement, I would say that's the most basic of all. But but also along with that is hard work. You never get anything done. And you know everybody says, you know, farmers are hard workers. They are teachers are hard workers. You bet doctors are hard workers. Nurses you got on the list, anything worth doing. It takes hard work to be successful. At it. And so that's that's another value that I think is important. But the most important one is your word is your bond, and your handshake means something. And when you look somebody in the eye and you say, you know what, deal is a deal. It's a deal. You don't have to have three pages of paper work to follow it up with a bunch of lawyers or sign an off stand this is the right thing to do. So so so I would say that, and then then I would also say from a from a just a Montana perspective, and it goes to to to you and your in your show, is is that what makes Montana great is it's overall state where you can get outside and get away from it all. And and I'll tell you there's not a lot of places like that left. And uh. Being able to go out there and and and and see uh nature, see ecosystems as they're working, Um, is just pretty amazing, especially in this century we live. And it's why I pushed so hard for things like the Land of Water Conservation Fund. Why because these ecosystems aren't going to be around in ten years or fifteen years. They're going to be developed. There's gonna be houses on them. There's gonna be chains across the across the posts in the road, so you can't go up and get to your favorite spot, whether it's for hunting or fishing or whatever. And so, uh we need to understand what we have, and we need to understand that if we don't look with a little bit of vision moving forward, it's simply not going to be here. And and it's one of the reasons too that that I really I'm nervous about the billionaires that want to buy up ranches for their own you know, private hunting place. Um, many of these ranches, you know, they're the old time ranchers, are the folks that help, you know, build this state. And they were always open to have hunters come on as long as the hunter was respectful to the land. They could come on and they could hunt, and they could fish, they could do whatever ever they need to do as long as they gave, you know, got permission to do it. Now we're seeing these these you know, these big ranchers, billionaires coming in and buying up ranches and locking them up. And uh so now public land becomes that more valuable because now that private land is locked up, they don't put it in block management. They don't and do things necessary to do to be able to allow Um, you know us Montana is to be able to get out and enjoy the great outdoors. Yeah. I mean, I think a lot of people that listen to this show, and there's a lot of people that go outside, are particularly interested in your you know you started on that down that path a little bit and what you were just saying, but your philosophies and and maybe your ideologies around like land use in general. You know, how did you develop you know, where you currently stand on public land and private land use and and how all those things played together in this state in a very important way because there's a lot of public land here. Yep. Well, I mean, look, I'm a big believer in multiple use. I think public lands can be used in multiple ways, and I think it can help it can help hapitat for instance. Um, I think you know, well, managed forest helps habitat. That means you cut, you cut some trees, you you helped develop that grass basis out there. Um. I would also say that that that uh, um, why public lands have become such a big thing as is it? Um you kind of take it for granted, unless unless there's a you've never been able to find a place to go hunt. And and and when I say you don't have to be a millionaire to go hunt in that public land. You know, we're all public land owners, that's right. So you can go out there and you can access it. If you take the time, you can, you can really have a really good experience. But but but but in the end, you know, it's the public lands. I mean, if you take a look at western Mississippi versus Eastern Mississippi. I mean, that's one of the big issues. It's it's why when we talk about things like the Land Water Conservation Fund. Now it helps for parks in some of the cities and things, which is very very important, but the bulk of that goes to the west. Yeah. Yeah, I mean it's it's that's a veried use. And that's one of the big topics right now in in the public lands, uh sphere. And you've been a big proponent of Lando Wark Conservation and everybody, hopefully everybody's listening to this, knows what that is. If you don't let me know, I'll tell you, I'll tell you in another format. But you've been a big proponent of at there. You know, I feel as though it's not as accepted among your colleagues in a lot of ways. And why do you think that is. I mean, it seems to me, uh, you're taking royalties from offshore drilling and you're you're forwarding that, uh, those moneys to play. Like you said, there's a park here in Bosman that my son plays that that has a little sign right right beside it that says funded by l w CF. So, um, there's a lot of compelling reasons to to sign that villain and perpetuate that money year over year and fully fund this. Why you know, I think you've already said kind of why you support it, But what what's the dynamic? Well, I think that part of the reasons. I don't think a lot of people understand that this really pays back to the treasury in a big, big way. Because you know, it's seven billion dollar year industry in the state of Montana, the outdoor economy of seventy four thousand jobs, arguably the biggest industry in the state of Montiana, and the Land and Water Conservation Fund is the key for access. It's the key to make sure we have of land. Moving forward, We've got this checkerboard thing going in where you've got a section of public land a section of private land. And and you know you can't walk dagon lea across the get right. You can get some amazements to make it so there's more accessibility and and and that's why I fight for it. I think the folks who are opposed to it are opposed because they don't think the federal government should own anything. Um, the federal government is us, by the way, it's our land. It's it's not the federal government owns it. It's And it seems to be a strange dichotomy whereas, you know, Center Mike Lee out of Utah is talking about introducing a homestead Act, and your family homesteaded in this state of the nineteen ten, nineteen twelves, and here you are, you know, coming from a long line of homesteaders. And here's another here's the land transfer advocate talking about, you know, reinstating the Homestead Act and trying to spin up these this political jargon around around that terminology. So how do you find that to be how do you speak about that in a way that really hits home for folks that are confused because they're hearing from one side. Um in some ways, you know, Senator Least said it straight out, public land is elitist, wilderness is an elitist um principle. And on the other side, we're saying it's for everybody. Everybody owns it. So there's just, you know, like a lot in our politics, there's a large separation the division. Well, I can tell you how I've found the most success, and it's just talking about economy. Um, if if if, if it didn't contribute to seven billion dollars, and that's Montana's economy. Colorado's got different figures, Oregon has got different figures, Each state's got different figures. If it didn't contribute seven billion dollars to our economy seventy four thousand jobs, it would be tougher to sell by just talking about quality life, even though quality of life is probably more important than all that stuff. But but but but so you have to talk about it from economy when when I'm talking to somebody who's who's a strict conservative, and by the way, strict conservatives based off of conservation, so you think that be on board, but they're not. But but when I'm talking to I'm talking to him about you know, this is jobs, this economy, this is we invested all or today, we get a dividend tomorrow. And and really that's that's the pattern moving forward. And and but but you know, Mike Lee, you know where Michael is coming from. I'll tell you. I'll tell you the people that I get really really discussed it with. It's the folks that on one stand will be with you on a news conference on Atlanta Water Conservation Fund and then thirty minutes later walking and take a vote to cut the Lanta Water for Conservation Fund. And regular people aren't paying attention to this stuff, so they never know when they get away with it. But it drives me crazy. Either you understand it and you're for it and you'll promote it like Richard Byrd does in North Carolina bout the way because he's a real stalwart for this fund, or or you turn around and say, you know what, I kind of like it, but I'm not going to put it on the line for it. And that's more accurate. You know, that's not hypocritic. Well, you you would imagine as you as you try to you know, you campaign and you try to spin up that what I would call pandering. That public land pandering is pretty easy to do. It's America, it's idealism, it's what we all get to share it. It's like everybody a big hug around this public lands. I think easy to do. Um. Your opponent, if you go to his website right now, says I support UM. Well, he says I oppose land transfer, and his record is maybe a little bit against that. What's your what's your take on that? My my take on that is is that I think he changed because Montana's told him that he wasn't going to get the first base if he didn't, and so he changed. I still think internally he wants to transfer land to the States. I don't think there's any doubt about that. If you take a look at the the Kyo Ranch, um, the situation was on the landboard, a prime l cabitat for access to for hunters in Montana, and he voted against it. If you take a look at the Horse Creek twenty thousand acres in southeastern Montana, really really really good habitat uh and voted against it. Uh. There's a proposal in Washingt d C. Right now that's not a comprehensive proposal at all to remove wilderness study areas, just just remove them for no no particular reason, just remove them so you can mine them or whatever you want. Um. And he supports that. He also has been supported by billionaire Wilkes brothers and their whole family both politically and through uh, through leases on his land. And I think a lot of the conservation votes he's taken to keep those easements out of things like Horse Creek in Tikio Ranch is because he's being influenced by those billionaire ranchers from out of state that want to buy up to lant to make a private hunting uh, you know, paradise for them only to use. It's it's uh, it's what we've got to be careful of his Montana's to be honest with you, and and I you know, look, there's all sorts of folks that that come to this state and and I love them all as long as they appreciate that Montana is the greatest state in the greatest country in the world. And the reason it's the greatest state in the great country in the world is because of the people. And quite frankly, our public lands, access to the great outdoors. It's really that's simple. You know, you can go to New Jersey. I'm not urges is great, but you know it's not Montana by a long shot. I mean I'm moving here from Texas. Yeah, I mean it is. Uh. And having lived in Illinois in the past and growing grew up out of East I mean there is Like I said when talking before we hit record about it's the way people speak about the outdoors here, the way um every weekend that you can't find anybody in town. I mean, there is a different not only a different lifestyle, but just a different way of thinking, in a different spirit and people that have the freedom to go outside and doing I agree, and I think it's it's it's good for you. I think it's it's good for your health and uh. And I think it's good for your mental health too. And it's one of the things that I serve as ranking member and the v A Committee is to use the outdoors, use use those programs of fishing and hunting out there to help these folks that are coming back from from seventeen years of war with with mental health issues. Because I think it's good physically and I think it's good mentally, I think it's good for the soul. Yeah, I would agree with that. UM. Speaking of health, I want to talk to you a little bit about chronic wasting disease. You have been the big proponent of funding research and testing UM for for states and for tribal associations to be able to do one test, but then fund research around where c CWD is showing up. How do we fight it? How do we stop it spread? So you have a bill out there for a sixty million dollars of funding. Talk about that bill and then kind of where it is, and it seems to be held up a little bit. It is, it hasn't been moving. Look, the key is is that we do something. We do some of, if not the best research in the world. Chronic wasting disease can be Uh. It's a big problem. It's a big problem not only in widelife. It's a big problem in domestic livestock too. So we have an opportunity to just go out and try to get ahead of this curve. And by the way, it's a hard curve to get ahead of because we're already starting to see a crop up just about it bewhere and so my point was, let's give the researchers the tools they need to try to find a test for c w D so that we can pinpoint it uh and potentially UH stop it spread uh as quickly as possible. Uh. The bill right now is is just setting a committee. It needs. It needs to get out. We need to get bipartisan support for it. UH. As with anything, it costs money, and oftentimes money is hard to come by in Washington, d C. But I will tell you from uh from from a wildlife standpoint and a domestic livestock standpoint, We've got to get some research done. And I can't help to think that research on on elk, for example, or or any pick pick, any game game animal couldn't be easily transferred over to cattle. Yes, absolutely, Especially the funding shifted around in the techniques for finding out what causes this and how how we can deal with it in a common sense way of moving forward, I think will help everybody. It's a matter of letting people understand that this is a problem and we need to get on top before before real bad things happen. Ye. Is there anything that Montana's or folks listening can do to kind of get educated about your legislation and similar legislations that around there. Well you can. You can go to my website, my my my senter website, and uh, if you search around a little bit, you'll find it and as you can read up on it. And then the other thing I would just say is if you're concerned about c w D and you think we need to have research to find out it's caused and how we can potentially prevent it, Um, write your congressman, write your senator. I know you're your This podcast goes far and wide, and so uh, just drop an email and in or or pick up the phone and make a phone call. And I will tell you that a lot of people say, ah, that doesn't do any good. Those guys don't listen to us anyway. Far from the truth. The truth is is that those emails make a big difference. Those phone calls make a big difference. And so just do that and just say, hey, look at this bill Tester's got. It's a good bill. I wish I could give you the number of it. I can't right now, but it'll be listed on my website and you could even give them the number. And look, I talked to folks from both as. Yeah, I work with people from both as. If you get them get it on their mind, they'll able to come up to me and talk to me about it, then we'll get them signed up. It's called the Chronic Wasting Disease Support for States Act, and that's a it's a proposal for sixty million dollars man which which by the way, is a rounding error and it's not a briefcase that's right, But but the truth is it would be money well spent. Yeah. Um. The other big point around your works, and really that goes along with access is extraction and mine and your philosophy is around that kind of land use and and it's a big political thing. But also a big thing is you've seen in the Yellowstone Corridor and the game to Yellowstone. Um, talk about your philosophy around extraction where you don't want to see it, where you like to see it, what your what you thought? Well, there's places where it is entirely acceptable, and there's other places where, um, the ecosystems are more more valuable than gold. Very frankly, the best one I can think of is the mine at the head of the Yellowstone River at the doorstep of Yellowstone Park. Um, I've got a bill that hopefully we can get through in the Lame Duck yell Still Gateway Protection Act, because it's it's gone through committee in the House and in the Senate, and so it's it's teed up to get done. That would stop a huge mining operation by a foreign company at the headwaters of the Yellostone River. So, um, is there gold there? There probably is gold there. But the truth is that the impacts on the water, the impacts on wildlife, the impacts on those hundreds of small businesses up and down Paradise Valley in the Livingston um is not acceptable. And uh, I have not looked at the figures per SAE, but my guess is it's probably that Paradise value is probably worth about a billion dollars in economic activity to the state of Montana. And then if you want to talk about if they screw up like they did insortment Landusky and the water is polluted, Um, that fishery is gone, then you're treating water in perpetuity. It's just not the right thing to do. So I've got to build to basically take the federal lands off by the same token. Um, there's a mine south, the Columbus Platinum Pladium mine that is incredibly responsible. Mind, they do everything right. It's a zero discharge. They absolutely they play by the rules, and they pay their employees and they treat them well and and uh they provide a valuable asset to the whole world and so um in those cases, it's the right thing to do. At the head of the they the Elstone, it makes no sense. You're you're you're asking for a disaster. Yeah, I think it's I always talk about pro nuance and anti bullshit like that's my political stance. I don't know what party alle get Maybe I don't know about that, but it's to that point. And this is one of those things where around national monuments here last year became a big political football throw back and forth. Um. And to me that a lot of the nuance is lost in the conversation of should we you know, should it be a monument, should it not? Should we extract here? Should we not? A lot of the nuance is lost. And uh, the balance that you're talking about there, I think is important. No, it's it's it's it's critically important. And I will tell you, I will tell you just just from how we look at laws and how we look at projects and business, you've got to have a little more vision than ten or fifteen years. Yeah, I mean, truthfully, I mean that's if if you're looking short term, long term is gonna each up. And I think anybody who's successful in business, they look short term, but they also look long term. If you're not always looking. And in this day and where the economy is changing so rapidly, you've got to fifty years ahead. And and like I said earlier with the Land of Water Conservation Fund, if these landscapes go, if these ecosystems go, because we're making stupid decisions today. Man, we're doing our kids a total injustice, just a total injustice. Yeah. And there they're not coming back, not coming back exactly right. They we're giving away one of our greatest economic drivers, and that's our outdoor recreation economy. Yeah. Well, uh, you know, I think Hunters Bangas can appreciate your voice in that way and and and how you speak up in a pragmatic way for the things that makes sense. And the only thing, you know, I don't get to talk to senators that much. So the only thing that The other question I have for you is is today's political climate. You've been um, you've been in the Trump sphere as of late and and been um you know, in the ire of some of his attacks, and just what is what's you're taking the current political climate? You know, how it's affecting this country and how we forward the conversation because as hunters of anglers, everybody that I talked to, everybody seems to be like a common sense, pragmatic one, the right thing for the outdoors, onright thing for the country. How do you how do you find um going to d C and and and fighting through the bullshit way? It's way to partisan Um, both parties a running their corners way too quick um. And And quite frankly, I believe it's for a number of reasons. I blame it on campaign finance. I think that the decisions have came out to UH to have corporations to be people and allow and limited amounts of dark money without no where it comes from him and who's trying to buy your state isn't helpful UH. And it creates for more of a piper hyperpartisan situation. I think the fact that we don't have reapportionment done in a way, and now reapportions the districts and nieces in the House, not the Senate. Where you have a district that is bright blue or a district that's bright red. It doesn't allow for bipartisanship. Been working in the middle to get things done that can help everybody. And I think if we if we dealt with both of those in a common sense way, which wouldn't take nuclear physics degree to figure it out, I'll tell you that, uh, it'd be it'd be easy to go. But but I'll also tell you on the other side of the coin, I've got great friends on broad side. CI Johnny Isaacson, for example, the chairman of the Veterans Committee, and I as a Republican, I serve as ranking member. As a Democrat, you wouldn't find a finder man. Johnny is a good man, and and we trust one another, well, stick up for one another. We has have one another's backs. And we started this a year and a half when I took over and he took over, and we just said, do you want to get something done? And we just want to put out political rhetoric and fight like everybody else does. And we both agreed, let's get something done. That ended up with eleven bills being put on the President's desk, just with v A, just just you know, uh, letting the v A have the tools they need to be able to serve the veterans of this kind country. And I think if other committees did that, um, I think we'd be far better off. Um. And and I don't know if it's just because Johnny Isaacson and myself have the personalities that we can get together. But it hasn't been that tough. I'll just tell you it's just you sit down and you talk. If I got a problem, I don't talk behind Johnny's back. I go look him in the eyeball and say, hey, this is what's going on. And you know what, he does the same thing. And we end up find a common ground pretty darn fast under those rules. Yeah, I mean that's what we need. Common ground. I mean I think we public lay in common ground. I don't know, there's some sweet uh there's always a sweet spot, sweet ending right there where I could hide it all together. I'm not that smart. Center. Well, thanks thanks for joining me. We really you know, I feel like, um, I just want to say thanks for your public service. I know, UM, you fight hard for what you believe in, and it means a lot to folks like me to have you out there, regardless of if we agree on every issue or what your political party is, that you that you stand up for what you believe in. You're serving the public and your um and your endeavor. So we I appreciate that. I can. I can tell you for a fact, I believe in this state, and there's a day to go by that I don't fight for Montana. And I'll tell you why, because I think what's good for Montana, it's good for this country. I go. We'll end it right there. Thank you. That's it. That's all the episode number thirty two in the books. Thank you so much the Senator John Tester for joining the podcast and being part of this conversation. Very honored to have somebody like that be willing to spend time with me and to speak to all of you about when I believe, I mean, he truly believes. UM. I'm not one to dismiss all politicians. I'm not wanted to dismiss any idea that might come across that I don't agree with. But I found again, Uh, Senator Tester to be credible and to be pragmatic and straightforward dude, and I enjoyed this conversation I was able to have with him, and I hope you did too. Don't be afraid to let your opinions fly in the comments on Instagram. Go to the meat Eater dot com to where you'll find all my podcasts under the Hunting Collective. Go to um Benny O b for your one on Instagram. But we'll be talking about a lot of the issues uh, surrounding this podcast that we spoke with Senator Tester about. Hopefully this will be the start of a dialogue, um, not the start of any arguments um that we might have. So thanks for joining us again. We'll see you next Tuesday on The Hunting Collective. Hi,