00:00:14 Speaker 1: My name is Clay Nukeleman. This is a production of the Bear Grease podcast called The Bear Grease Render where we render down, dive deeper, and look behind the scenes of the actual bear Grease podcast, presented by f h F Gear, American Maid, purpose built hunting and fishing gear that's designed to be as rugged as the place. As we explore, this is a great debate what to do right now. We do we stay in the heated conversation, very interesting conversation we were having, but we would have to inform the listeners what we're talking to. Or do we just start off? Who's here? Hard to say. 00:01:02 Speaker 2: It's a roll of the dice. 00:01:03 Speaker 1: I'm going to start off, and we're going to go in the middle. So I've got to my right and I'm going to introduce him first, then I'll introduce the others. 00:01:11 Speaker 2: This is weird going the street, Yeah it is. 00:01:13 Speaker 1: But in the Tacovis hot seat is my friend Kaylen Balians. You guys just entered into like right in the middle of our conversation of when, like when was it October the third? 00:01:26 Speaker 3: Probably? 00:01:26 Speaker 1: I think I think Kaylin and I were bear hunting on October the third, and he killed a really nice bear. I mean it was i'd say three point fifty. What did you think? What did we think? I can't really remember what we settled on. 00:01:40 Speaker 3: I think you said for sure three twenty five. 00:01:42 Speaker 1: So, okay, a big old boar killed in National Forest. Just we just went hunting for a day and a half, and so we skined this bear in the woods, quartered it up, basically left you know, a gut pile, the hip structure. I mean, I mean, you know, like the pelvis and stuff in some of the rib cage, big pile of bear. Though, left that bear and I came back, maybe even just five days later, and you could not have told that we skin that bear other than just some you know, the leaves. It was just kind of a beat down, greasy pile. But this is what I was about to tell you when these people interrupted us by turning the podcast on. Was there was bear trails coming in from two directions to that carcass pile, like padded out, like where they were stepping in the same tracks like they do. And I don't know why I didn't think about it, but I bet we could have killed another bear sitting on that carcass probably days later, yeah. 00:03:04 Speaker 3: Yeah, probably the one that runs him out of woods. 00:03:06 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, So when what happened? I mean, go ahead and you can just kind of quickly tell, like you're hunting, and what happened? 00:03:15 Speaker 4: You know, Basically I walked into a bear fight and I didn't know it. Yeah yeah, I heard the the racket going on down there, and I knew it was a bear, but I did not know what was going on. 00:03:29 Speaker 1: Were you hearing him vocalize or just leaves crunching and popping? 00:03:32 Speaker 4: No, I could hear that. I could hear the vocalization. Yeah yeah, I don't know what sound you call that, but. 00:03:39 Speaker 1: Just woofing and chattering and huffing. 00:03:43 Speaker 3: Yeah yeah. 00:03:44 Speaker 4: So I eased down there to get a closer look, which I could just see the one bear, but it was like postured up. He got the coming off into that little draw blow me, you know where the water was at, and I just let him come. He got about twenty and I shot him, almost run me over, come right up out at men. I just turned behind my tree and let him go by. 00:04:11 Speaker 1: How close do you think he actually got to you bear? Really? Five ft? 00:04:16 Speaker 3: Oh? Yeah? 00:04:17 Speaker 1: Yeah, So what happened is Kaylin's I saw right where it all happened. You know, he is this little there's a dry creek bed and then there's a steep bank that kind of goes up on a little mini ridge kind of, so it's almost like you're in a tree stand in a way, and you're shooting kind of down at an angle. And I think your era passed through that bear and hit the rocks on the other side of him. That scared him so that the threat was from the opposite side. 00:04:45 Speaker 3: Where the other bear was at. 00:04:47 Speaker 1: Okay, that's where we're getting But the bear turned and ran straight towards the shot, right because you know, the ear clacking on the rocks was bigger than the sound of the bow. 00:05:00 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, closer. Yeah, And he didn't know I was anywhere around, so right, yeah. 00:05:03 Speaker 1: But he just shoots straight up at you. 00:05:06 Speaker 4: Oh yeah, I shoot and re should get another arrow. Well before I can get the other arrow, I look up and he's there. I mean, he's already on me. So I just rolled behind a tree and he goes by, and he makes a little loop and runs right back to where he right shot him. Matt, he at the other side of little waist, didn't he hell run up the other side. Yeah, and yeah, I watched him die. Yeah, yeah, he just ar it up, fell over death Moon, and I thought it was over. 00:05:33 Speaker 3: I got. 00:05:36 Speaker 4: Probably twenty yards of him maybe, and just crouched down waiting for him to die. I got to hear in another racket, the same vocalization whatever you call that. 00:05:47 Speaker 1: At this point, you've only seen one bear. Yeah, you don't think you knew you heard potentially like what sounded like a fight, but you didn't know there were two bears. 00:05:55 Speaker 3: Right, Yeah? 00:05:58 Speaker 4: So I glanced up on the hill and here comes one bigger than the one I just shot. And he's coming to that bear I shot. He doesn't know him around either, So I let him get down to the bear, but I stand up first. 00:06:13 Speaker 3: Just wave. That doesn't do it. 00:06:16 Speaker 4: He kind of glanced at me, kept coming, so then I yelled at him. That didn't do it. He's still coming. So I threw a rock at him, and he finally turned and walked off. 00:06:26 Speaker 1: And you hit him with the rock? 00:06:27 Speaker 3: No, I didn't hit him. No. 00:06:30 Speaker 1: How close did he get to the dead bear? 00:06:33 Speaker 3: Ten or fifteen feet? I mean he was pretty well to him? Wow? 00:06:38 Speaker 2: Yeah, was he going to fight more? 00:06:41 Speaker 3: I think so? Yeah, that's it. I waited to see what happened. 00:06:48 Speaker 1: Yeah, what were you thinking, man? 00:06:52 Speaker 4: That this bear has just whipped this three hundred and twenty five pound bear, so I know he can whip me, and he's staying on you're a logger. He's still mad. So yeah, after he wasn't really leaving, I left. 00:07:06 Speaker 3: I just went to the truck. 00:07:07 Speaker 1: Okay, now, okay, so you chunk of rock at him and what does he do? 00:07:11 Speaker 3: Oh? 00:07:11 Speaker 4: He just kind of side heels and he drops off back end of that creek where I just shot that one, and then comes to He didn't run. 00:07:18 Speaker 3: Oh no, he come up on my side and he's circling me. 00:07:22 Speaker 1: Oh wow. Yeah, yeah, I knew that. I knew that, but it's like it's like he didn't. He didn't spook like you would have thought. You would have thought the second he knew there was a man standing there that he would have just Yeah. 00:07:33 Speaker 4: I thought he would know from the bears that I've been around, and he didn't encountered. 00:07:37 Speaker 3: I thought. 00:07:37 Speaker 4: As soon as he realized you know there's a human here, he's he's gone. 00:07:41 Speaker 3: But no, no, he didn't. 00:07:43 Speaker 1: Like how much bigger was he than the one you shot. 00:07:46 Speaker 3: Notice he was noticeably bigger. 00:07:49 Speaker 1: I mean, liked make you think the one you shot was small. 00:07:53 Speaker 3: Well, I mean not small. 00:07:54 Speaker 4: I knew it wasn't a small bear, but huh, but first glance, I said, oh my gosh, I mean this bear is quite a bit larger than one of you. 00:08:03 Speaker 3: Shows. 00:08:03 Speaker 1: Well, I remember so well you I. 00:08:07 Speaker 3: Told you it looked like a boltswagen coming off the hill. 00:08:10 Speaker 1: Yes, well, but it also it painted my perception of how big the bear that you killed was. Because Kaylan shoots the bear, it's laying there dead, but this other bear is circling and he just goes, I'm out of here. So he dives off the mountain and goes back to the truck and I'm still off hunting. Don't have cell coverage or well no, I didn't where I was at. I come out well after dark, well after dark, and Kaylen goes, I got good news and bad news, and he's like, I killed a bear, but it's still up in the mountain, on the side of the mountain, you know, and it's like, I don't know, it's getting dark at seven thirty that time of year, and so now it's eight o'clock and you know. 00:08:58 Speaker 4: It's more like nine o'clock probably probably how far back in was it. 00:09:02 Speaker 3: It wasn't terrible. 00:09:03 Speaker 1: It really wasn't that far from the truck. It was quite a bit of elevation change. 00:09:09 Speaker 3: But I had been a whole lot further that day. 00:09:11 Speaker 1: Yeah, he had made a huge loop and killed it on the way back to the truck. But I remember you telling me that you just thought it was an average bear. That's kind of what I or the picture that I painted because of this other one was so much bigger. And I actually remember telling you I bet you shot a sal yeah, and and I bet you shot the smaller of two, because I couldn't figure out why there would be two even together. And I said, I bet you shot a soal, and that other one was just a decent boar. And so we go up there in the dark, and the second I see his bear in the light, I just go, holy cow, that's a big bear you shot, Kaylen. I mean it's like, oh yeah, I mean Stomper. I mean it might have. I mean we were I really try to be conservative with bear weights because it's so easy just to be like, oh that's a four hundred pounder. It was a big bear, and it, no doubt weighed three twenty five. I mean probably three twenty five. Three seventy five wouldn't surprise me, you know. So, I mean a piggin and the picture you could tell how Biggie is because it's paws are enormous. I didn't even see the bear, but I could tell the picture good bear well. And then cal he had just been whipped by this other bear, that's right, And and the bear looked so big. I mean, when you can tell a difference, I mean a fifty pound difference between two bears standing side by side, you almost can't tell the difference, right, like they would almost look identical. One hundred pound difference. You'd start to see a difference, one hundred and fifty pound difference, and it's like that bears way bigger. But I mean, I think I think it was a monster, the other one. I mean, you're the one with no. 00:11:08 Speaker 3: I never doubted it. 00:11:09 Speaker 4: He told me when he got back to the truck, and he's like, you ain't gonna believe what I just done. 00:11:15 Speaker 3: And I was just joking killing the nine. He said no, but I could have. 00:11:21 Speaker 4: And then he told me the whole story, and he said it he said that other bear was big. 00:11:26 Speaker 1: Yeah, well I was. Just as the podcast started, I told Kaylen, I said, man, I think about that all the time, and partly because me and bear went back in there five to seven days later, and it was it was as if a bear had never been in those woods. I mean, because that same day I had been over the mountain from you and had all but killed a bear. I mean, it was probably the closest I've been in national forest of killing a bear, but not killing it. I'm setting over a little water hole and you know, nine o'clock in the morning, I see a bear coming like straight to the water hole. Wind's good, everything's good. It's a color phase bear, real pretty color phase board wasn't very big. I bet it didn't weigh one hundred and ninety two hundred and ten pounds maybe, I mean, just lanky, kind of tall, but chocolate brown. And he's coming up this little dry creek to this little pool of water. And I'm in the same scenario as you up on the side of a steep ridge. I mean, it was a deep drawl like this on both sides, just straight up. He has no idea in there, He's walking winds thermals are carried up. I mean it's done. He's at twenty yards and I stand up and it's like I'm in a tree stand and he, I mean, he's just about to walk out in front of me, and i'd draw the bow back, and I don't know why, but rather than staying in the creek and going to that water hole, he just he just turns and starts going up the other side of the ridge from me. But he's gonna walk right out in front of me. I don't even panic. I'm just like, no problem, got the bow drawn, and I'm just waiting for an opening. And you know, he hits a couple openings that you probably could have shot, but you shouldn't. But I just knew he was gonna just stop in some opening up there, and anyway, he doesn't. He just he just walks straight up that mountain, and rather than veering towards the water hole, he starts to veer more just like straight up, and he just kind of like just just slips through my fingers, you know. And I sat there the entire rest of the day, entire rest of the day, and thirty minutes before dark, a bear came from the opposite. A black bear came from the opposite direction, and there was a whole water right in front of me. That was the main watering hole. Bear trails beat out to it. But thirty yards up from this main water was as real mall pull of water a bout his I mean like two inches three inches deep, just barely any water at all, and that bear, rather than coming the main hole, drank water out of that hole. And I saw him just kind of lift up his head and kind of look around and I could just barely see him, and I kind of stood up, and he just kind of sat there by that water for a minute and then just turned and walked away. Came and I tried to go after him, but anyway, it's a great day of hunting. Brought bear back in there, and we did the exact same hunt day and a half and didn't get didn't even see one, didn't I. 00:14:35 Speaker 4: Was that close to killing one thirty minutes after daylight. Yeah, Yeah, I saw three bear that one day. 00:14:42 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:14:42 Speaker 5: Wow, that was an unbelievable day of the forest bear hunting. Yeah, and then it just it just was gone. It just was completely gone. 00:14:52 Speaker 3: Quick. 00:14:53 Speaker 2: You're going to introduce the rest of us. 00:14:54 Speaker 1: Well, that concludes the podcast for the day. This is a unique render. We have the the guys that were on the last episode, American loggers, Kaylin vi Lines. This is the Kalyn Lines that told was was main player on that to his right, wild eyed? 00:15:21 Speaker 2: How'd you feel about that description? 00:15:29 Speaker 1: Oh man, I'm so glad you guys are here. The Josh is here. And then the one who is going to validate, validate or invalidate all these stories, the older brother of Kaylin Whalon Lines, who I'm told their father tried to name them Whalen and Willie, so Kaylan would have been Willy, that would have been happening, but their mother shut it down. 00:15:58 Speaker 3: That was always no. 00:16:03 Speaker 1: And then we got Barry DUKEM Bear, John nukelemb with us. Yep, so Bear brought a bow. He might show us, but no, it's pretty pretty rare for us to have the actual people that were on the episode. But I want to do something real quick before we get into the log and stuff. Is I've asked Bear to tell us a little bit about a couple of things that are going on that are relevant with conservation legislation. I want to be We're gonna try to be a little more active and the stuff that we all know that's going on, but like this boundary water stuff, and then there was one other thing going on in Mississippi. Give us a. 00:16:47 Speaker 5: Highlight of those bear Well, the boundary waters is the big event that I think everyone's been hearing about. 00:16:53 Speaker 1: But basically they're trying to make it to where. 00:16:56 Speaker 5: They're allowing foreign mining companies to come mine above the boundary waters and all the runoff of that is going to really affect the public land that we have access to. So overall it's a bad deal. We don't want it to happen. But through hunters and anglers calling in to their senators, they have postponed the basically the day that they decide whether or not they're going to allow it or not. So basically, through the voice of the hunters and anglers, that has has changed what's happening inside of the government systems. Yeah, because they were going to decide, I want to say it was two days ago. 00:17:39 Speaker 1: Yea, a couple days of February tenth or something. 00:17:41 Speaker 5: Yeah, And because of how many people were calling in and emailing their senators, they've postponed it because they're starting to see. 00:17:49 Speaker 2: That do we know a future date when they're supposed to decide that. 00:17:53 Speaker 1: I'm not sure. They just said they were going to do a more further analysis on the deal, and it'll come up again. It's come up. It comes up all the time, like every couple of years. Maybe maybe, I mean we were talking about this like a year ago. But the boundary waters are on the border between Canada and Minnesota. Yeah I think so, yeah, yeah, And uh but it's a it's a big, huge federal wilderness and uh yeah, I mean there's gonna be stuff like this coming up more and more. 00:18:30 Speaker 5: But yeah, but what we can take from this one is the fact that our voice inside of it actually changed so far, has actually changed to what's going on. So yeah, so keep calling and keep keep the pressure on the you. 00:18:47 Speaker 3: Know what I mean. 00:18:47 Speaker 1: It's like as we all know this, I mean that we hear it, but I mean, golly, we've just got to become more active in this stuff. And per For example, miss tell us about the Mississippi Bill, which has been kind of resolved, but it tells you what can happen. 00:19:07 Speaker 5: Yeah, Well, the attempt was to eradicate all hunting. 00:19:11 Speaker 1: With dogs in Mississippi. 00:19:14 Speaker 5: Unless unless it was on the private land that was two thousand acres of private land or bigger. That's the only that's the only land that you can hunt with dogs on. But that's including squirrel dogs, rabbit dogs, deer dogs, any any sort of dog hunting. And so they wanted to take it out because it was not fair chase, was the argument. 00:19:37 Speaker 1: They called it the the fair Chase. It was crazy. It was crazy what they called it. Uh do you bear? Do you remember what it was? Keep talking, keep talking, I'm gonna find it. 00:19:50 Speaker 3: Well. 00:19:51 Speaker 5: Yeah, basically, the the their point that they were trying to make was if you're hunting with dogs, that's not fair chase. It doesn't fall within the fair chase uh rules and guidelines. So but the good news on that one is is it got it got shut down. 00:20:07 Speaker 1: The bill is yeah, it was a House Bill eight twenty eight, and good news is it got shut down. But this just goes to show you these guys called it the Fair Chase Act, introduced to restrict hunting with dogs, limiting dog hunting to properties of over two thousand contiguous acres, which essentially would shut down dog hunting. You know, Yeah, no one has access to today private and you would feel like a state like Mississippi would be immune to this, and so far they've proven to be by the fact that the bill got shut down. But just the fact that that is even there just tells you that kind of stuff can happen anywhere. 00:20:46 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:20:47 Speaker 5: So, and what is important is that even though we don't have a lot to do, like with the with the Boundary Waters in particular, like we hardly even know what state that's in. I've never been to the Boundary Waters, but it's still important for me to call into the senators because it's the it's it's even if it's not relevant to you, it is because eventually it's gonna make it to you. If as they start to come for things at the bottom ring of the lighter, it's going to work its way up. So it's important to stop it now, calling into your senators now before it reaches you. 00:21:30 Speaker 1: When I started learning about bear hunting with hounds, specifically, the state I'm thinking of is Michigan. Like ten years ago, I did a did some filming for the Michigan Bear Hunters Association, and what I learned was that they just have built into their culture that you have to fight for your rights to hunt. Like their kids. It was like it wasn't even normal. It wasn't even abnormal that they had. They were just like politically active. It's just part of being a bear hunter. And I think more and more in the days ahead, that's probably gonna be what we have to do. Which I mean, as hunters, we're the people that just like want to people to just leave us alone. I mean, we're not the ones who are wanting to go get involved in stuff. That's our nature. But that's also the nature of people who get stuff taken away from. 00:22:26 Speaker 3: Them, you know. 00:22:27 Speaker 1: I mean, I'm talking to myself because I mean, but I think in the future we're just going to have to be more involved. And the good thing is that there's a ton of organizations that are helping people get involved. I mean, like on on social media, there were so many groups that were giving you the number to call the White House switchboard. Ye ask for your senator. It's that easy. I mean, like you call this number, say I want to talk to the Senator from Arkansas, and they take you directly to his office. Somebody answers the phone, you talk to him. I mean, sometimes you feel like that may not be enough and it and it may not be right. It's something so. 00:23:09 Speaker 2: I wrote, I wrote our when that whole thing was going through, I sent an email to our our senator, and I mean I got it. I got a response back, but uh, I mean it got to him, you know. 00:23:21 Speaker 1: I sent uh. I sent a little video to my senator and I took a piece of white sandwich bread and put it right here, and I put my fist there and I put another piece of sandwich bread on top, and I said, mister, mister Boseman, this is what I'm going to give you. If you'd vote wrongly for this, send a picture of that knuckle sandwich. 00:23:43 Speaker 2: I'm sure that was well received. Just just kidding, just kidding everyone. Yeah, don't indict him now. 00:23:54 Speaker 1: I don't want to pick off Bozeman. He's he's he's he's a good guy. 00:23:57 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:23:58 Speaker 4: Most people are like me. They they take for granted what we're, what we do. I don't my hunting with dogs or whatever, don't. I've never seen it hurting anything. And don't think nothing about it. You don't think about somebody taking it away and then next thing you know, you wake up and it's gone. 00:24:22 Speaker 3: Choice we've been through it. 00:24:23 Speaker 1: You guys have had it taken away. 00:24:26 Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, in my lifetime, I've seen it happen. 00:24:29 Speaker 1: Tell us about that, because I'm from the wash Tatas where we can still run deer with dogs and regardless of whether you think that's good or bad, yeah, I mean. 00:24:39 Speaker 3: But yeah, it's a touchy subject. 00:24:43 Speaker 4: But growing up, Dad always had beagles and we grew up hunting deer with the beagles. I mean, we didn't see it hurting anything, and the next thing you know, it got shut down. 00:24:59 Speaker 1: I mean in the late nineties. 00:25:01 Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't remember exactly what it was. I just know why I got to be part of it. And I mean Dad was always he was a dog man. He likes to take the dogs. And when they shut that down, Dad pretty much quit hunting until deer hunting anyways, until me and him got started riding a lot and doing it that way. But yeah, I mean he just got enjoyment out of he's dogs and doing it like that. But yeah, that was that was in the back of my mind when you was talking about that. Is like, I mean, we take for granted that just because we don't think it's hurting anything, these people out there that do, and if they got a bigger voice when most of the majority are like me, I feel that they're just going to sit back and think, well, we're not hurting anything and let it go and then well. 00:25:45 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it was the late nineties when they outlawed deer hunt with dogs in the northern part of the state. And as I understand it, it was the it was the pet project of one of the commissioners that lived up here and didn't like deer dogs and that he knew probably couldn't shut it down across the whole state, and he wanted it shut down in this part of the state. And I mean, you know, twenty five years later, people hardly talk about it. 00:26:09 Speaker 3: It was. 00:26:12 Speaker 6: For me it was more than hunting. My dad's always been a hand man, but mainly a running dog man. Uh, it was more than shooting deer. Yeah, it wasn't about shooting deer. I mean you were out there, Hume. It was a way of life. 00:26:35 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:26:35 Speaker 6: Deer season was like bigger than Christmas, way bigger than Christmas. Yeah, and it was I mean it was a chase. And you hear that all the time about anybody can kill one with a dog, go cry. 00:26:50 Speaker 4: Yeah, starting out the fair chase act. Yeah, you ain't never tried to kill it in front as I started hunting with dogs. That was just the way we hunted. 00:27:04 Speaker 3: Uh. 00:27:06 Speaker 6: I'm not saying I haven't killed a lot of deer in front of dogs. But when they outlawed the dogs and I had to start still hunting, uh, I was like, this is easy. 00:27:22 Speaker 1: Mm hmmm. 00:27:23 Speaker 3: I mean honestly, I thought it was easy. 00:27:27 Speaker 6: Well, I started bowl hunting a lot when they outlawed the dog deal. 00:27:31 Speaker 3: Uh. 00:27:34 Speaker 6: And at that time there wasn't The guys in our part of the world that bowl hunted were hardcore, but there wasn't that many of them, you know. Uh, an early season. Then it was easy with a bowl. I mean it was just easy. Yeah, compared to I said a walker hounds coming and there wasn't no matt and he stopped. 00:28:03 Speaker 3: When you've seen that. 00:28:04 Speaker 6: Sunner coming, you started shooting, and when you run out of shells, you either had it dead deer or they were gone. 00:28:11 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:28:12 Speaker 3: Uh that's been about. That was easy. Was it fun? Most fun ever had? 00:28:19 Speaker 1: Yeah? 00:28:19 Speaker 3: It was the best way of hunting. 00:28:21 Speaker 6: The camaraderie yeah, Uh, everybody ganging up at whoever's house it might be that morning, coming up with a playing, drinking coffee. 00:28:33 Speaker 3: It was more than hunting. It was a way of life. 00:28:35 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:28:35 Speaker 6: Uh and likewise and't said, you know, I would have been getting on up there as a teenager, didn't realize what we had until it was gone. 00:28:47 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:28:48 Speaker 4: Yeah, that all That's what runs through my mind when you was talking about that, just because there's more people like me that ain't going to say anything and wake up and what you should have been speaking up about's gone. Yeah, and it's too late then yep. So yes, I fully agree that people need to voice and it can change things. 00:29:07 Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. 00:29:08 Speaker 5: For anyone listening that's interested, you can find all the information you need to at back Country Hunters and Anglers. 00:29:14 Speaker 1: Yeah that's that's a good one. They've got all the info for how to get in touch with your senator. Mm hmm, well man this this uh Wenna say something, Josh. 00:29:26 Speaker 2: I also want to talk about the bear Grease channel. Oh yeah, channel, and we got talk about honest this new film. 00:29:33 Speaker 1: We're not gonna be able to talk about Loggin. 00:29:35 Speaker 3: Sorry, guys, I watched that video of the day. 00:29:37 Speaker 1: Hit our video many so we have so the ten years. Eleven years ago, I started the Bear Hunting Magazine YouTube channel. At the time I was running Bear Hunting Magazine, started a YouTube channel and we made videos for eight years. And that channel videos too. 00:29:57 Speaker 3: By the way, I. 00:29:58 Speaker 1: Started watching a few. Man almost had just drifted away from my consciousness for. 00:30:04 Speaker 3: Sure between the last one. 00:30:06 Speaker 1: And five years. For five years, the channel has laid dormant, and yesterday we restarted it back up and we renamed it the Bear Grease Channel. And so it's through meat Eater. I had some people saying, Hey, Claire, did you quit me Eater? No, I didn't quit meat Eater. This this is this is through them, which we're thrilled about. That's it's a good deal for us and for them. 00:30:32 Speaker 3: But he had had come along. 00:30:33 Speaker 1: Too, exactly well. And Bear's gonna be the main guy on the channel. This first video you saw, watch his videos anyway, me too, Man, me too. But there's gonna be weekly content dropped on that YouTube channel. And Bear's already got a bunch of really cool stuff that he's done. Yes, he killed a hog with a self bow, he elk hunted. Uh, he's been on a big falconry trip. 00:31:04 Speaker 5: I'm excited for the Falconry where we trapped some hawks in Texas. 00:31:08 Speaker 1: Legally, but it's but it's YouTube style content like the Meat Eater Mothership channel is like television type quality production and it's I mean, it's great, it's fantastic. This is like YouTube native, like fast paced, just like really showing you what's going on, less production, no music stuff like that, and so yeah, we're real excited about it. 00:31:37 Speaker 2: It's gonna be awesome. 00:31:38 Speaker 3: Yep. Yeah. 00:31:39 Speaker 1: So next week, well there's a there's a film out right now. 00:31:42 Speaker 5: Yeah, Squirrel Hunting on Mules came out yesterday. Well it'll by the time this podcast airs. There ought to be What do you think of his mule, Slow Trap? 00:31:51 Speaker 1: Kaylin? Do you see all that shoot? 00:31:54 Speaker 4: Pretty laid back, pretty laid back. I would trade you I have one what he got. 00:32:00 Speaker 1: I bet you would. 00:32:02 Speaker 4: Talk to me before he well he's three three yeah. 00:32:08 Speaker 1: And I mean that mule literally didn't even flinch the first I mean you saw it. 00:32:13 Speaker 3: I was surprised, But the one he was talking about I shut off him. So oh it might be. 00:32:19 Speaker 1: So the backstory, now you remember this, I was going to send Slow Trap to Whalen. Yeah, last summer I actually contacted Whaling Whaling train horses. No, I was gonna have Whaling trained slow trap and just and and then somewhere in the process, Bear was like, I'd like to train it. And so I texted Whaling back and said, hey, sorry man. 00:32:51 Speaker 2: And you haven't talked to him since. 00:32:55 Speaker 1: Sorry about that. Left you hanging all right. I bet it was really awesome for Bear to get. 00:33:00 Speaker 4: Oh, yes, and that is what When you told me that, I was like, that'll be a good one for him to start with, just from the videos and stuff i'd seen on the meal, I kind of had him peg and I thought that'll be a good one to get his feet wet in. Yeah, now he's hooked and we can send him something else. 00:33:16 Speaker 1: Yeah, Whaling's gonna send you one now, probably a crazy one. 00:33:21 Speaker 3: We'll see. 00:33:24 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a that That is a nice little meal. It's I wish it was taller. You got one like that. I bet it's not fourteen hands, maybe fourteen. 00:33:35 Speaker 3: If he's fourteen, he's big enough, I know, but he's three year old. He's gonna grow. 00:33:39 Speaker 2: He probably will will he grow after well. 00:33:42 Speaker 4: Three. 00:33:43 Speaker 1: So band Joe, which is his half brother, uh huh, was still growing. When I and he was six years old, he grew a lot. 00:33:55 Speaker 2: How much could you expect him to grow another hand? 00:33:58 Speaker 3: Maybe that dad always told us boys that they'd grow a horse mule would go till the seven. 00:34:04 Speaker 1: Okay, I think it horse mules mail. 00:34:08 Speaker 3: Yeah, it all depends. I think on the mule too. 00:34:10 Speaker 2: Is there a difference between a john mule and a horsemill? Just interchangeable words. 00:34:14 Speaker 1: We have a lot of words, depends on who you're talking with. We've only fed that mule grass hay too. I mean we've fed it a little bit of grain here and there, but like it has not had ty Evans told me he said, yeah, if you fed that mule alfalfa hay for a year, he said, it probably speed the growth. Oh yeah, but I mean the mule has free access. I just bought a year and a half old. 00:34:41 Speaker 4: Well, I say, just boways been a couple months ago, now a little younger than what I was planning on buying. But I can wait till May to start messing with him. But I got him thinking he'll be I mean, you've had this discussion like a fourteen fourteen to two hand mule, and that's what I thought he'll probably be that. 00:34:58 Speaker 1: Well. 00:34:59 Speaker 4: I put a stick to him the other day and he's already fourteen one, I think, So he's gonna wind up being probably bigger than what I wanted, bigger than what you want. 00:35:08 Speaker 3: But we'll see. 00:35:09 Speaker 1: But yeah, he's. 00:35:10 Speaker 3: Growed a lot since I got him, so we may do some trading. We'll talk later. 00:35:16 Speaker 2: It's kind of turned into the mule swapshop here at the BRender. 00:35:20 Speaker 4: Yeah, the one he's talking about. We can bring him up here and lead him in here. Lucky did that one the other day. 00:35:25 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, ze yeah, Well, uh, one other ticket item. Jannist would tell us has a video coming out this week that you should watch. 00:35:37 Speaker 3: Sam. 00:35:38 Speaker 1: It's about his Manitoba bear hunt. But Joannie is going to be with us on the next render. 00:35:44 Speaker 2: Did you rumor of that today? 00:35:46 Speaker 1: Yeah, he's gonna be with us, so we'll wait to talk until then. But uh, but no, this episode, man, it was so good. This login episode really was. 00:35:57 Speaker 3: Yeah, it was. 00:35:58 Speaker 1: Uh. In the what happened was I came to talk to Kaylin and it's and I didn't really plan I mean, I thought we might talk to somebody else, but there wasn't too much planning involved in it. And while we're sitting there at the global headquarters of the lines Logging. 00:36:18 Speaker 3: Which is the barn. It's a barn. 00:36:20 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I hope that was for pick up you being sarcastic. Yes, but at first I was like, I was kind of confused. 00:36:32 Speaker 2: It's like Kaylin takes us to his corner office. 00:36:37 Speaker 3: Good. 00:36:37 Speaker 1: You needed to be confused for. 00:36:38 Speaker 6: One thing you said about that that was completely true. It is a location, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's just you, but it is in a hacup spot. 00:36:48 Speaker 1: It is how wide is it? I guessed fifty foot. 00:36:52 Speaker 3: It's thirty about fifties what it is? Yeah, I was right. I don't know what you said. It's fifty foot wide. 00:36:58 Speaker 1: I'll be done. 00:36:59 Speaker 3: It's fifty foot long. 00:37:00 Speaker 1: That's what I meant. That's what I That's what in my head. 00:37:02 Speaker 2: Opening on the open side, Yeah, the open sides. 00:37:05 Speaker 1: Okay, Yeah, So Kaylen and I are are sitting there and uh, Cody and his girls just kind of randomly pull up. 00:37:14 Speaker 3: And going home. I had been to dad, I was going home. 00:37:17 Speaker 1: Yeah, and then he walks over and I told them I don't think I've ever done the main part of an interview captured it quite like that. Usually I'm trying to direct people to get on like these good headsets and just so the audio call is really nice. But I had this little handheld deal and I was just kind of like bouncing around from one to the other when they would talk, you know, and uh, and they just kept talking as they do, and uh, it was I I knew that it was really good. 00:37:51 Speaker 2: Yeah. 00:37:52 Speaker 1: And then I did tell this to Kaylen earlier when he started telling me about the story with Ethan. That's why I came there. That's what I told Kaylen the story that I wanted to hear because I'd heard him tell me the story on the bear hunt that you guys interrupted us talking about. At the first of the podcast. Me and Caylen were going down there, and he told me, yeah, so it's all time together, you know, it's like a yeah, And I envisioned a podcast that kind of revolved around that story, honestly, That's what I had in my head. But and and it ended up being that. But so Kaylen, we just go back and forth and tell me about logging and trucks and equipment and stories about Frankie Dale which were fascinating, Yeah, truly were. And then Caylen starts telling me about Ethan, and what I told him just today was that I was like that close to telling them to stop because I wanted to record that on the good equipment. I mean I might have even one time like started to speak and almost mumbled words, but he was going, and I just if there's one thing I've learned after years of doing this, is when somebody wants to talk, just let them talk, which is sometimes hard for me to do. I want to interrupt him and say something else, but he just I just let him talk and tell the story. And it was so good, so authentic. I was like, there's no way that we're telling that story again. 00:39:33 Speaker 3: That was it. Yeah. 00:39:35 Speaker 4: Well, knowing them too as well as I do, that was as natural as you could get them to talking. Yeah, I mean you stick headphones on and Mike and her face and I mean it's not the same, but me knowing them, I knew Whereams was that first of all, and everything going on, but that was that's what, in my opinion, made it one of the better one, just because it was so natural. I mean, it wasn't just like Cody showing up nothing stage. I even told my wife pads. I pat you on the back. I said, it's unbelievable. I said, Cody just showed up. Yeah, and he just. 00:40:10 Speaker 3: Rolled with it and it turned out good. 00:40:13 Speaker 1: Well, you felt that to me? You felt like you were just standing there with us, which is what you always want. 00:40:21 Speaker 2: Yep. 00:40:22 Speaker 1: But sometimes it doesn't translate. Like when it was happening, I knew that were that they would tell me really cool stuff, but I thought, this is going to be really hard to translate this to the listener. I wasn't. 00:40:34 Speaker 2: I wasn't there, but just listening to it myself. I really liked that, Like I felt like I was standing there with y'all just listening to y'all, y'all talk about, you know, tell stories and stuff, and you know, you could hear things echo in the back. You could hear the girls, the dogs. Yeah, I like that. 00:40:53 Speaker 3: Well that was the saying. 00:40:54 Speaker 4: Two days before that, I was down there helping them work on that dozer, and that's what it felt like. It felt like when we were standing down there just talking and going on. Well, he was working on it. 00:41:03 Speaker 1: So it was cool. So we get done. I say to Cody, I say, uh man, this is gonna turn out really nice something like that, didn't I And he goes, what turned out nice? And I said, you've been sitting here watching me put this microphone into your face. And he's like, what do you mean? And I was like, we're gonna make a podcast. He had to have been tricking me. This is when Cody like, you think he's just crazy, but really starting. Yeah, he was like, what do you mean? And I was like, you think I'm just I was just here just getting this audio so I could go listen to it myself in the truck. It was funny. 00:41:40 Speaker 6: Well, in my mind you were going to go In my mind, you were going to his house, right, Yeah, y'all were going to do the podcast. 00:41:48 Speaker 3: Yes, you know, I thought what you were. 00:41:50 Speaker 6: Doing down there, we're just gonna be like a little piece of something here or there. 00:41:55 Speaker 3: Maybe. 00:41:55 Speaker 2: Yeah, you didn't know you were going to be a star. 00:41:58 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:42:00 Speaker 2: Did he make you sign a waiver? You can probably get all that You probably get all that content back. 00:42:06 Speaker 1: Josh, No, it was so good, it really was. Bear What stood to you, Well, I like the the look inside of the logging world, because for me, as a hunter on National forest public land, you're always coming across loggers and there's kind of a separation between the hunter and the logger. 00:42:40 Speaker 5: I would say, like in a lot of ways, it's even viewed as like the loggers are kind of opposing the hunter's goals, and it kind of like, you know, like I feel like the loggers aren't always painted in the best light. But I really, I really like this look at it because y'all are hunters and your loggers, and you live close to the land. The land is, you know, providing your living, so that gives you more reason to care for the land and to steward the resource that you're going and pulling. So I really like the look, like the real look inside of the inside of the logging woods. 00:43:20 Speaker 1: That's that's a good that's a good comment. 00:43:22 Speaker 2: Yeah, I like that because I think I think things like that can be villainized. Like it's easy to villainize people when you don't know them, when you don't know their ethic, when you don't know how they do what they do. It's easy just to say, oh, these guys are just out there cutting trees. Yeah, and uh, I think one of the one of the most impacting things to me was listening to you guys talk about how different sections of timber have been generational for you guys. I mean, that's that's incredible. I mean, that's that is exactly what we need more of, not less of, you know, we need we need this stuff that provides for families, people can work a good job, while at the same time preserves the preserves the habitat for the animals, preserves the longevity you know what I mean, it's it's sustainable for generations. And that like that really impacted me when when you talk about what was said this these woods have put many kids through college. 00:44:23 Speaker 1: Oh that was that was a guy I know that. I remember him saying that to me over here, and he told me, he said, this track of timber has put he said, every thirty years they cut it, send a kid to college. I mean, and it's it's true. And and the other thing that people don't realize that aren't that don't know loggers or and even hunters would know this. There is very little timber in this country. I mean like none basically that is virgin timber. 00:44:54 Speaker 2: It's all been oa oh yeah. 00:44:56 Speaker 1: And it's a renewable resource. I mean even out in Big Wooly National Forest. I mean there's probably some places there in the eastern side, in some of these deep draws and ravines that didn't have marketable timber. You know that just it just wasn't worth getting in. Those trees today probably are cedar trees that are two foot or at the back. I mean, you wouldn't look at that tree and think that tree is five hundred years old, but it might be. I mean, would you guys agree with that, Like in some places there is some virgin timber. 00:45:27 Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean on the government you take so government land like uh like some of that wilderness land that they don't touch at all, but. 00:45:38 Speaker 1: But they did back. I mean, I know personally a lot of federal wilderness in this part of the world that would have been cut to the ground. But now it's wilderness. 00:45:48 Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm talking about Uh, I'm talking about you know, a lot of place well in my lifetime and before I know they haven't cut yeah. Uh but guess what you go through there now mm hmm. Those big trees are falling over yeah. Yeah, if you Dad's famous one of the Dad's most famous lines ever is it's a crop. 00:46:10 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:46:10 Speaker 6: I've heard him say that my whole life. If you don't take care of it. Nature takes care of it. I mean, those big trees. As much as I myself like to ride and hunt in big timber, there's nothing better it being in big timber. 00:46:26 Speaker 3: You know. We was talking about that last night. 00:46:28 Speaker 6: We was watching the Turkey Hut and it was a timber turkey hunt because there's nothing better than killing the old the old woods gobbler, there's nothing like them. But nothing lasts forever. Yeah, those big trees that are protected if you can't. There's this section of government land that I hunt and have for a lifetime. You go back from one year to the max, and it's amazing how much of that big virgin timber. 00:47:04 Speaker 3: It's fell over. Yeah. Uh. 00:47:07 Speaker 6: And when it starts falling over like that, it's a mess. It's a mess for years. You know, it's just barriers grow up. It's just a mess. 00:47:16 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:47:16 Speaker 3: That's nature's way of taking care of it. Yeah. 00:47:19 Speaker 6: I mean you can either manage it or God will. I mean, that's just work. 00:47:24 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:47:25 Speaker 1: Well, and there I said it on the podcast. But I think we know now how incredible that some you know, select timber harvest can be for wildlife proper. I mean, the best thing you could do for a big piece of timber if you wanted to make it. Deer in Turkey habitat is cut some of the timber, and so, you know, and I think most of the people that be listening to this would know that, but the general population maybe in some other places, you know, might you might say loggers. They might go, oh man, yeah, those are bad guys. And it's just ridiculous. I mean, like I said, even though the world is much more, much more plastic and much more metal than it used to be, you know, one hundred years ago during the Wooden Age, we still use an incredible amount of wood. I mean, just I mean, we live in a very wooden world still. I know the guy that, well, if you're talking about paper and cardboard, I mean, I think that there's going to be a transition more to cardboard and paper getting away from plastics now that they're seeing how wild plastics are just in terms of all the all the stuff. But anyway, I mean, so it's it's hard to be upset with a logger when if you're a human today, you know, and especially like these guys. And so the next episode is going to be primarily with Teddy via Lines, which is Cody's dad, Kaitlyn Whalen's uncle, and he started. The first things he said to me was he said, I love big timber, and he said I hate clear cutting. We select cut logs our entire lives, you know. 00:49:16 Speaker 4: And well did Josh's point wall Togo when he was talking about that stood out to him about the generation's log in the same spot. I can remember, which I've been out of this business for twenty years now, but I was like then when they was telling their stories about being eight nine year old with their little chainsaws. Well, I was twelve and they put me on a skitter. I was getting three load of logs a day behind my dad. 00:49:39 Speaker 3: No, he can try to warn up y'all twelve at twelve. 00:49:43 Speaker 4: But one of the first things when he said that, something popped in my mind. Something Dad told me, Well, I'm a kid, first of all. And just a few drags in and Dad stopped me and said, all that little stuff, don't run over as little as you can, because he said, them oak bushes that big around, He said, it's going to be cut one of these days. He said, be mindful, of course, you're on a piece of equipment that it's you can't not run over everything, right, I mean, but you can be selective on how you operate. But that was ingrained in us at a very young age. This is what's going to support the next generation. And it's the same thing. I drive by and say, well, Dad, what didn't you cut that tree? Because to me it was as big as some of the other ones he had cut. But he'd say, Son, we got to leave something. 00:50:44 Speaker 3: To come back to. 00:50:45 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:50:46 Speaker 2: So, and that's that's really really that's that's profound, you know what I mean. It's a it's a profound thing to make choices like that because I think I think humans, especially Westerners, have gotten really short sighted, you know what I mean. It's really about instant gratification, how it's going to benefit us right now in the moment. And to have people that are thinking, hey, I want to come back to that tree in ten or twenty or thirty years, that's sampling. 00:51:18 Speaker 4: There's a good possibility that some of that stuff Dad told me about them to or. 00:51:23 Speaker 3: Have cut it since. 00:51:24 Speaker 2: Exactly so, man, before y'all leave, y'all ought to go. 00:51:27 Speaker 1: I'll take you in my front yard. I bought and planted myself in two thousand and five a two inch at the base red oak, just like I bought from the landscape place and it was two thousand and five. I mean, I know for a fact when I planted it, and that tree, yeah, you could cut it, make furniture out of it. 00:51:49 Speaker 2: You want them to take it down for they leave. 00:51:51 Speaker 1: Matter of fact that y'all bring your saw, I'm ready to cash it in. 00:51:57 Speaker 2: Y'all are mainly cutting hardwoods. 00:52:00 Speaker 1: I mean that's all that's up here for for the most part. Yeah, some some pine. 00:52:04 Speaker 6: When we were kids, I would say we cut a lot of pine on a couple of different tracks, a lot of pine. But in the last several years, very little that weave even. 00:52:19 Speaker 1: Just because it's not there. It's not marketable not there. Yeah, well it doesn't seem like the I mean you go south of the Arkansas River and it's almost not all pine, but those pine plantations. I mean it feels like the world's got plenty of pines. You wouldn't even I mean hardwood seems not a little part. 00:52:37 Speaker 3: I mean that's there's some pine out there. Uh. 00:52:41 Speaker 6: Some of these government tracks, yeah, we'll have you know, pine on them, and most of that's pretty small stuff. 00:52:48 Speaker 3: Whatever but. 00:52:50 Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, most of your private land stuff, we don't. We just don't run across much pine anymore, not apply. 00:52:58 Speaker 2: Mhm. 00:52:59 Speaker 1: Okay, on what what stood out to you? I know it's hard to listen to a podcast that you were the main guy. But I mean, like, did anything, did anything stand out to you? 00:53:10 Speaker 3: No? 00:53:11 Speaker 1: Not really, he probably didn't even listen to it. 00:53:16 Speaker 3: Okay, I can vouch for him. 00:53:18 Speaker 1: Okay, Okay, Well he's just like, yep, he told just like a good job man a few words. Well, Cody, did what I mean? Were you did you hear? Did we get right? 00:53:31 Speaker 2: How do you do putting it together? 00:53:34 Speaker 1: Oh? 00:53:34 Speaker 3: I told him when we came in here, he did with what he had to work. 00:53:38 Speaker 2: With, the talent, the talent he had to work with. 00:53:42 Speaker 3: Yeah, but what actually what stood out to me? 00:53:45 Speaker 6: I didn't know it was out He told me last night that we were coming here today. Yeah, he's like he put that out today. 00:53:53 Speaker 3: So I'm a home last night and watched it. 00:53:56 Speaker 6: Oh when he got talking about Ed, you know, just his uh that mentality mm hmmm. I mean you can't you can't describe a man any what is. 00:54:21 Speaker 3: Mm hmm. He describes his. 00:54:22 Speaker 1: Dad mm hmm. Yeah, that was. I mean we put like six minutes of probably of content there, and I mean, Caitlyn could have said so much more. But what you said about him was profound. And I have said that statement that you that the couple of ideas that he had there, I mean just just kind of like life philosophies, you know, just uh when he said, uh, well, talking about contentment, but then talking about when he said, if you're really being honest with people, you know, you're probably not going to get rich. And I've said that to multiple people, and again you qualified it and said, I know that that's not entirely true. They're wealthy people that are honest, but there's a lot of truth to it. And you know, just the idea that it just goes against the grain so much of what just pulsates through American society. I mean, it's like you almost feel bad for not trying to get rich. I mean that's the vibe that I feel. It's almost like if you're not trying, it's almost irresponsible. This is America, capitalism, most prosperous nation on earth, and it's just like I'll tell you something that I read and I'm going to try to tie it in and you're going to think I'm crazy. But I was reading a book about Inuits. I'm going to I'm going on a big trip in a couple of weeks. And they said that nomadic hunter gatherer people. A huge difference between nomadic hunter gatherer people and agrarian people was the way that they viewed objects. And this guy said that nomadic people, this is all going to tie together. Boys, nomadic people typically viewed objects with suspicion and kind of because they knew that they if they were going to take something with them, they were going to. 00:56:42 Speaker 2: Have to carry it right. 00:56:43 Speaker 1: They thought about things in literal terms of weight, and so in general, nomadic people did not gather up material objects. Farmers, on the other hand, agrarian societies were just like, well, I might as well take that home a place to put it, yep. And this guy said that the Western the Western thought process has been so influenced by the agrarian world that we have we falsely think that desire for material wealth is a native human desire that just runs inside of all of us. Like he said, that's actually not true, because you like psychologists and all these people would say that it is. That's just human nature. Like if you just pulled pluck somebody out of Africa and out of Europe and out of India and you put them all in a laboratory, they would all have this innate desire to accumulate material objects and wealth. And this guy is saying, no, that's not true. We just are so ingrained with this this thing that it's this desire for material wealth is actually something relatively new. And when Europeans first arrived in North America, they were astonished. It's in the it's in the record all over the place. It's fascinating to me. They were astonished at these guys trying to find gold, Like they were like, what do you what do you want? And they're like gold what for? I mean you can't eat it, you can't can't plant it and make it grow, you can't build something with it. And they actually thought these guys were crazy. And so I just think about Eddie and kind of the mentality just like not this file. And again, to me, the key component is contentment, not how much money. I mean, you know, it's not like, well, if you have more than this many dollars, you're you're evil. I mean, you can't do that you know, but just this idea of contentment being pretty powerful and and it makes me aware of the vibe of of this generation, of this time. I mean, that's that was a profound section. I thought. 00:59:08 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, that was the best part to me by far. Yeah. 00:59:15 Speaker 6: Just knowing him, Yeah, knowing him, I mean he just wanted to be my dad. I mean him and dad are one and the same. Yeah, I lived in the house of one. That's the only difference, honestly. 00:59:28 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:59:30 Speaker 6: Uh, But growing up, I wouldn't have said, that's that's the guy I want to be, like, he's you know what I mean, he wasn't that larger than life. 00:59:44 Speaker 3: He was just the dead to me. 00:59:48 Speaker 6: But the older I got, you know, uh, and before he got sick and whatever, just going down there, just going to his house. U. He might be on the back porch with a cup of coffee in the winter time. He'd bet now by that stove with a cup of coffee whatever, just going in the house. 01:00:09 Speaker 3: You got that feeling of yeah mm hmmm. So to me, that was that made the podcast for me, Yeah for sure, Yeah mm hmm. 01:00:29 Speaker 1: Yeah, that was that was unique. 01:00:33 Speaker 3: Unique. 01:00:35 Speaker 2: I'm looking forward to the next episode, you know. 01:00:40 Speaker 1: It's it's I hope, I hope us bringing up Frankie Dale was I mean not surely his family would be proud of what all was said about him. Uh, those stories were really interesting to me. Yeah, I mean, just the way you describe him. And then I wouldn't have known that he died, Like the listener was on the same journey as me, because you started talking about Frankie Dale, and you know, you you talked about what a character he was, and then and then I go and basically in my mind, I'm leading to questions about, man, this is really dangerous. 01:01:21 Speaker 3: You know. 01:01:22 Speaker 1: Do y'all have stories of guys getting killed? Now, I knew about Kaylin's story about Ethan, That's kind of why I'm there, But I had no idea that y'all would have known people that had been I mean I figured you did, but known people have been killed. And then for Kaylen go, well, Freckie Dale got killed like three years ago. I mean, it just painted the picture. Yeah, I mean, and then it also when I started doing the research on logging, just how dangered it actually is. 01:01:53 Speaker 3: Yeah. 01:01:53 Speaker 1: The Bureau of Labor Statistics puts out stuff every year about the most dangerous jobs. You know, I didn't. It wasn't like a deep deep dive into it. But basically in the nineteen nineties, logging peaked as the most danger like it was the most dangerous time. Yeah, I mean, it almost feels like maybe back in the day deeper it would have been more dangerous. But since the Bureau was keeping stats, it peaked in the nineteen nineties. I wonder if y'all had any insight. 01:02:26 Speaker 3: Into that time we got into it. 01:02:28 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, y'all got into it. Yeah, not your dad's. 01:02:32 Speaker 4: I could see the pace of it, the pace, the pace picking up in the nineties, yeah, yeah, yeah. 01:02:39 Speaker 1: And there was less there was mechanization, but there were more hand cutting. 01:02:44 Speaker 3: Going on, you bet, yeah. Yeah. 01:02:46 Speaker 6: And today in the nineties it would have been most of the guys around here would have been hand cutting, I mean cutting them down, I just don't yep. And they had also been cutting the links we cow bucking up. Most all that would have been changed that work, I mean, there was probably the nineties probably would have been when I probably seen the first buck up saw, which is a mechanical hydraug solid hooks on load and you can cut them the lamp through out there with a loader. 01:03:16 Speaker 1: Okay, so you're you cut them at the stump, they fall over and then the buck up saw cuts them into the links the load. Yeah, gotcha. 01:03:25 Speaker 6: The first buckups I probablyould ever heard. That would have been in the nineties and I was a little kid. 01:03:29 Speaker 1: So it got safer when he had a buckup saw. 01:03:32 Speaker 3: Yeah. It took up one, it took it took out. Yeah. 01:03:35 Speaker 1: Yeah one time you cutting through that log. 01:03:37 Speaker 3: But it's like Kim talking about getting hung up. 01:03:39 Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, when he got hung up in the log ball that was because he was bucking up log with a chainsaw yea instead of having the buckups. 01:03:45 Speaker 3: All that takes that gentlement out of it. 01:03:47 Speaker 6: Yeah yeah, yeah, I mean that would have been the heyday. Well that's when it is, you bet. 01:03:53 Speaker 1: So that's when it peaked one hundred and twenty eight deaths per hundred thousand workers per year. And that was way above like the number two thing in the nineties. So this is what I was trying to describe, Like the second thing, I don't even know what it was, but whatever it was, it was deaths like in the like fifty sixty if it was commercial fishing, and they give the statistic based upon one hundred thousand workers. Out of one hundred thousand workers, one hundred and twenty eight died today. And I think the most recent stats I've found were like twenty seventeen or something, and it was a little bit unclear, but it was between fifty and one hundred deaths per one hundred thousand today really, and logan was still the most dangerous, but it was right in line closer to in line with commercial fishing, commercial fishing, iron working, small aircraft pilot. And when you think about that, that makes sense too. It's like per one hundred thousand, you might be like, you know, how many how many people we hear about people around here that are dying in little plane crashes occasionally, But anyway, it's pretty interesting stuff. 01:05:13 Speaker 3: Yeah. 01:05:14 Speaker 1: The other interesting stat that I learned was that and now this was an older statistic from like it was a couple of years old, but that the average American uses one tree eighteen inch tree hundred foot long and paper and wood every year. Did that was that surprising? 01:05:37 Speaker 3: A hundred foot long? 01:05:39 Speaker 1: You didn't listen? Did you even listen? 01:05:40 Speaker 3: Cody nd. 01:05:43 Speaker 1: That's what it said. The amount of realized the tree couldn't be one hundred, So I mean. 01:05:49 Speaker 2: Just that amount, that's what they said, just in paper products. Just mean the number of Amazon packages that I get at my house and the amount of boxes I break down. 01:05:59 Speaker 1: That the surprise, But that's increased in the last I said after COVID, I wanted to start investing in cardboard companies. 01:06:07 Speaker 2: Yeah, no doubt. 01:06:09 Speaker 1: Everything's in cardboard. 01:06:10 Speaker 3: Yep. 01:06:11 Speaker 1: I mean everything shipped, everything's in cardboard. But anyway, that's a that sound like a lot. I wouldn't have thought every American was using one giant tree every year. I'm thinking about just buying my tree straight from these. 01:06:27 Speaker 2: Guys making your on cardboard, just just mail order. 01:06:32 Speaker 1: Maybe that's a new business. Y'all could ship people logs just so they could hand pick, because that's the way it works. 01:06:38 Speaker 2: It's like over there, dugout canoes in there. 01:06:42 Speaker 3: Yeah. 01:06:43 Speaker 5: I've actually been looking at these big snakewood logs that they shipped from Canada, like a thousand bucks for a six foot log to ship it. Oh really, and yeah, I'm really considering it because I've never seen a snake wood boat. 01:06:57 Speaker 3: We may have some snake woodland around you think. 01:06:59 Speaker 1: Is that? 01:07:00 Speaker 2: Is that a thing y'all have her. 01:07:02 Speaker 7: If I ever heard of speaking. 01:07:14 Speaker 1: Of wood, show us your bow. So this bow new bow, speaking of wood. 01:07:22 Speaker 5: Yeah, speaking of speaking of wood, I got osage orange black walnut on the handle with a big knot going right through the middle and then all of wood, which surprisingly well, actually not surprisingly, but it kind of caught me off guard. Whenever I was cutting through that olive wood, it smelled like green olives, like really really strong, and even whenever I'm filing it, it smells like olives. 01:07:47 Speaker 1: But I can you smell it right now? Probably it kind of has a pungent, like a sharp odor. I wouldn't have picked it as olives, but I smell when you're smelling that that odor, I think is just the hard wood. 01:07:59 Speaker 3: I don't like all you don't want to smell that owner. 01:08:01 Speaker 5: I think it's just from the place I got it smells like that. 01:08:05 Speaker 1: But no, whenever I cut through it, it smelled like olives. 01:08:08 Speaker 3: I'll take your word for it. 01:08:10 Speaker 2: I like that riser on there in that grip. 01:08:14 Speaker 1: It's not finished out. You know, this is the rough, so he'll he'll take a lot more off of that. 01:08:19 Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, but I'm kind of trying to the carm hole replicate more of a like your fiberglass recurve. Like if you look at a recurve, it's it's got a lot more material on the handle and you can get a lot deeper in that grip. 01:08:34 Speaker 1: And that's one of the major factors bigger handle or why it's easier to shoot a fiberglass recurve than a self bow. And so I'm trying to get as close to that as i can, but it'll still needy handle on it. Yeah, but anyway, there it is, looks good. Did where did that stave? O sage? 01:08:53 Speaker 3: Stave? Where'd you get that? 01:08:55 Speaker 1: The O Sage? 01:08:57 Speaker 5: I believe this stave came from one one of my one of my bowyer teachers. 01:09:04 Speaker 1: He gave me that stave. Do y'all have osage over there? 01:09:10 Speaker 3: You know, not about knowledge? 01:09:12 Speaker 1: You don't see it. Man, We've got we've got a lot of osage. I think the further west you get, you get more. I mean, I've got a ton of osage on this property. 01:09:23 Speaker 5: Yeah, we're got weird cut We're in kind of like a like a zone where there's osage. 01:09:31 Speaker 3: Yeah. 01:09:31 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's incredible wood, man, when you cut it and cut it with a saw. It is almost neon yellow. Have you have you ever cut it with us? 01:09:43 Speaker 3: All? 01:09:44 Speaker 1: Yeah? And you just see a big old pile this bright. It dulls over. 01:09:48 Speaker 5: If you see one that's like thirty years old that's been sitting in the sun or taking a lot of use, it'll be jet black, like really jet black black black. 01:09:58 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's pretty wild. 01:10:02 Speaker 2: Is that bow right there? 01:10:03 Speaker 3: What? 01:10:03 Speaker 2: What's what do you what do you intend to do with it? Is that gonna be a hunting bow? Is that gonna be a yeah? 01:10:08 Speaker 1: Yeah, this is gonna be a hunting bow. 01:10:10 Speaker 5: I don't know if I should say what I'm exactly I'm doing with it? 01:10:17 Speaker 2: Can you foreshadow? 01:10:19 Speaker 7: Not? 01:10:19 Speaker 1: Certainly? 01:10:19 Speaker 2: You're not a shadow like you're dad. 01:10:21 Speaker 1: Kidding, I'm kidding. Were probably here's a shadow. 01:10:25 Speaker 5: We're going to Alaska and I need to make the bow totally waterproof. 01:10:30 Speaker 3: That's what. 01:10:32 Speaker 2: There's your foreshadowing. 01:10:35 Speaker 3: I want to know, how do you how do you come up with what poundages? 01:10:43 Speaker 1: Well? 01:10:44 Speaker 3: Is that all about right now? String? Or is it all right in the bow? 01:10:48 Speaker 1: It's all in the bow. 01:10:49 Speaker 5: I mean you can adjust it a little with a string, but yeah, I'll put it up in a tailer and rack, and I'll take wood off of this side and I'll put just a bow scale on it and pull it down. 01:10:58 Speaker 1: He's constantly testing the wight. He'll put a string on it, test the way. 01:11:03 Speaker 3: You know what you've got. 01:11:04 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's yeah, and when I stand it, it'll probably lose. But he's had several that got it kind of got away from him a little bit, and he's like, you know it's too it got too light quick, you know, so you can once. 01:11:20 Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean you sometimes you can cut him shorter, make the string shorter, but yeah, it's it's no good once you get him too late. 01:11:28 Speaker 2: Have you ever had one blow up on you when you're shooting. 01:11:31 Speaker 1: No, but I'm kind of surprised I haven't yet. 01:11:34 Speaker 5: I know a lot of people who had him blow up on him. 01:11:38 Speaker 1: Gary Nucom had an American compound bow. There was a company called American. Did you ever hear that in the nineties. Uh, there was a company called American. And he was shooting trying to shoot bows super fast. He was shooting just the lightest arrow possible, and so that's real hard on boat, trying to get to shoot real flat. He kind of had like hot rid bows and I remember being out in the yard with him one day when that thing just came apart at the compound bow. 01:12:11 Speaker 4: There, I had a high country done the exact same. When I got done, I was holding the riser. 01:12:17 Speaker 3: That was it. Everything else was hanging down here. I don't do that again. 01:12:20 Speaker 4: Yeah, oh yeah, there's pieces of that, but I never did find Yeah. 01:12:28 Speaker 1: I find that in the archaeological record one day. 01:12:32 Speaker 3: Uh. 01:12:33 Speaker 1: Well man, thank you guys for coming. Yeah, and it's it's uh. We could have we could have had you on after this next episode, but it just worked out for y'all to come this time. Whalen, what what stood out to you? I hadn't really even asked you that. 01:12:51 Speaker 3: No, it it brought back a lot of memories. It was. It was good. 01:12:59 Speaker 4: Start finish for me because it did. Like I said, I've been out over twenty years. Cody brought up a good point where ago, I've got two brothers. They're sitting right there, and to see them what they've done, it's good. I got a lot of laughs thinking about because it brought up a lot of memories. Think about them too, one of them, whichever one of them, talked about them. Color and the homelight chainsaw, and I can remember. I think it was Colin that he took that old color, and it was it didn't want to start a lot of times. 01:13:36 Speaker 3: That's a famous yeah, afraid. 01:13:40 Speaker 4: It would start to good the first time, the first time once it got hot, A what did want to start? 01:13:44 Speaker 3: Now? 01:13:44 Speaker 4: Well, I witnessed him crank on as much he got mad, and as far as he could throw. 01:13:50 Speaker 3: That saw, he throwed it over the hill. Yeah, and left it. 01:13:53 Speaker 4: Dad come in to fill up with gas and he was like, where you saw? 01:13:58 Speaker 3: Because I got mad? He won't know why I hadn't bucked up the laws? 01:14:03 Speaker 4: Yeah, why why haven't you done your job? And then he says, and where's your saw? Yeah, it's over that hill, said we'll go get it. 01:14:11 Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. 01:14:13 Speaker 4: That and coming in with dragon logs and seeing them playing baseball, sticking. 01:14:17 Speaker 3: Rock and bus meant we had done our job. Yeah we're caught up. 01:14:21 Speaker 1: Yeah, and you're caught up like that. 01:14:23 Speaker 4: But yeah, no, it was I'm like Cody, the the contentment that our father had. 01:14:31 Speaker 3: Looking back makes a lot more sense now. 01:14:36 Speaker 1: Mm hmmm mm hmm. 01:14:40 Speaker 4: Recently stepped away from a twenty year career for that purpose to have more contentment. To be to be home, and. 01:14:51 Speaker 3: I always knew. 01:14:55 Speaker 4: Cody brought up a good point in the podcast about it being addictive, and I can tell you for me, I loved driving a skitter. I mean that's what I grew up doing, done it for well until I was twenty four, I think, and working inside for twenty years, never could get used to it. I enjoyed my job, I enjoyed the people, but I didn't even have a window to look out of. And it was hard. I mean there was days I would have loved to have been sitting behind a big molder in his tearing at roar and grabbing trees and going. And now I can get back outside again. 01:15:36 Speaker 1: And do you mind telling us? It brought up a lot of what you did and what you do now. I mean, you don't have to, you. 01:15:43 Speaker 3: Know, it's fine. 01:15:43 Speaker 4: Yeah, I went to tell us some combat for twenty one years. Yeah, pistol shop customers. 01:15:50 Speaker 3: Pistol shop here, eleven custom a rs. 01:15:54 Speaker 4: And God blessed me with way to provide for my family when I the year I started for them was the year my oldest daughter was born. And I was able to step away because I mean, just like the last few days in the wintertime, thursdays you don't work. I need a steady paycheck, and I was able to step away. Now I'm helping my cousin run a turkey farm that's less than a quarter mile from my house. So for the first time in a long time, I've got up every morning for the last six months and watched the sun come up. And I literally wrote a mule to work several days. And it's just it's been great. But to my point that I was able to do it, and the contentment that I have is it's priceless. I have a better understanding what our father always told us. 01:16:52 Speaker 3: Mm hmm, yeah. I mean, I don't want to talk too much. You can edit out if you don't like it. And I told you editor when I. 01:17:02 Speaker 6: Told you, But have you asked us what the biggest benefit was? And I said the freedom. 01:17:09 Speaker 1: Yeah. 01:17:11 Speaker 6: Uh five years ago, six years ago, in twenty twenty June twenty twenty, I found out that I had cold cancer. 01:17:24 Speaker 4: Oh, redact to that editor, put it back, put it back back, that's what. 01:17:28 Speaker 1: Yeah, he didn't hear what I said. I made a joke when you started to the editor to cut it out. Yeah, And then when I realized where we're going. I'm like, we better keep the sin anyway. 01:17:37 Speaker 6: Oh, I was thirty six years old, found out I had cold cancer. 01:17:42 Speaker 1: Wow. 01:17:43 Speaker 3: Leading up to that. 01:17:46 Speaker 6: H I mean, I'm not gonna throw out numbers or talk about production or anything. But leading up to that point, the logging business had been good for us, really good. Oh. And I got to the point I was working on Saturday, lots of Saturdays. If I wasn't working on Saturdays, I was taking care of equipment. 01:18:10 Speaker 3: Uh. 01:18:12 Speaker 6: I loved the bass fish in the summertime. At night, I loved the bass fish, tournament fish whatever. I had quit bass fishing, I mean I was, I was working. I mean I wasn't even hunting like I normally would hunt. And then that summer I found out I had a cold cancer. 01:18:34 Speaker 3: Uh. 01:18:36 Speaker 6: I was cutting timber when they called me, had my phone in my pocket. I had been to the doctor. I knew they were going to call me whatever. And I had been looking to this little stretch of timber for a week. I mean I had cut everything out below it. I had it set up. 01:18:53 Speaker 3: Uh. And I was cutting that little section of some big, nice timber. That morning. 01:18:58 Speaker 6: I could hear Dad over here, he's cutting and Frank he was working with us the time he's over here. I could hear his slaves running and my phone but I've cut the tree and my phone vibrates in my pocket and it's the doctor. And he said, what we found is colon cancer. And he said it was early stages. He said, this is early. He said, I think you can probably get took care of me. He said, if you don't take care of it, this will kill you. That was exact words. I got off the phone. My chainsaw still stuck in a tree over there, Idland. I walked over there to white oak stump and I got down and I had done some bread. And I can tell you lots of stories about the whole, you know, just the whole what I came out of that with. But one of the biggest things I came out of that with was I'm not going to say I was to the point of being driven by a dollar, but I was getting there. I mean, I was getting to the point where, you know, we were doing pretty good, making some money. And when that starts happening, you want to make more of it. But guess what it's like you're talking about what you just you just keep wanting more. You'll never be satisfied if you left that. 01:20:25 Speaker 3: Drive you. 01:20:26 Speaker 6: I mean, I know guys that just like logging that much. They'll be out there on Saturday and they're really doing it for the money. They just like it that much. That's you know, I'm not knocking those guys at all. If that's what you love doing and get after it. But I think God put the brakes on for me. I mean, there's some other things that came out of that, but one of the biggest things that for me was God was like, what you know, this is what's really important. I had to kids at the time. One was gods should have to do the math. One was two, I think the other one was even younger. But after I got back held up, they did surgery. I mean, the good Lord took care of me cancer free. I've done scan after scan since then and scopes and so where a famous good But God healed me. 01:21:25 Speaker 3: We'll just. 01:21:27 Speaker 6: Shortened up and say God healed me because he did. Oh but after that, when I came out of that, I got healed up. 01:21:37 Speaker 3: I was like, Okay, what you know, what is really important? 01:21:42 Speaker 6: And then since that time, that's amazing how much more time I spent with Dad. Uh not in the woods. He was there for all of it, you know, work and we were said beside. But since then we spent the last five we've done so much more hunting. 01:22:03 Speaker 1: Uh. 01:22:03 Speaker 3: I got back into fishing fish all time in the summertime. Uh. 01:22:10 Speaker 6: I don't know, It's just it's funny how God can just hold you up and be like, what's really you know, what's your other point? I mean, We're only gonna get to do this one time. M hm, you better do what you I mean, if you got kids and friends and family, enjoy them. Because I heard a guy say that day, nobody ever said on their on their deathbed, I wish I went to work more. Yeah, and that's so true. 01:22:34 Speaker 3: Yeah m hm. 01:22:37 Speaker 4: Well that's the reason I'm doing what I do now, because looking back on took it for granted. Dad always told us, boys, when about the only time we took a vacation was in November, we'd take off a couple of weeks deer hunting, and that always still boys do it way you can I know now what he meant. I mean, I'm forty five years old and got two kids chased around all over playing ball and I love it. But a year or two ago, we had got out and my youngest daughter ride, took her, We went square hunting, took mom's dog, just walked a circle, killed a few squirrels, had a big time. And my youngest daughter had never even courted. And I told my wife then, I said something gotta change. I said, missed way too much. I said, things has got to slow down. I said, there's got to be more of this. I've always loved riding, loved breaking animals. Been able to get back to that, but that contentment, I mean, this is circle back around. 01:23:55 Speaker 3: But that's you can't put a price on that. Yeah, for sure, Dad now is fighting cancer. You know that. 01:24:06 Speaker 6: He just kind of found out in November. Uh, he's doing good right now, be real good right now. But when all that happened, and I was able to look back on, you know, the last five six years and be like, you know, I haven't taken it for granted. Every time we went, we're out, you know, doing something besides working. I mean, I've enjoyed it. And now looking back on his lot, I mean you can see what God kind of lined up for you. Uh, but it's been Yeah, it's quite journey. 01:24:46 Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, not to bring up everything bad going on, but our dad was diagnosed with liver body of dementia. 01:24:56 Speaker 3: Yeah, three almost three years ago. 01:24:59 Speaker 4: Now going on going on four years, and it seems but I hate to say it, but it seems like one bad thing after another just happened. But boy, it puts things in perspective. M Yeah, it makes you think about the things that he told you. Oh yeah, that's the reason this. I mean, yeah, I got a lot of laughs out of it, out of it and everything, but it brought up a lot of good memories. 01:25:33 Speaker 3: I mean that, don't get me wrong. 01:25:35 Speaker 4: We we've always had it good. Oh yeah, I mean not knowing any better, not knowing, and we didn't know when we as kids how tough. 01:25:45 Speaker 3: It probably really was. 01:25:48 Speaker 4: What our fathers mothers went through because we didn't know that we didn't have anything. I'm looking back on it. I mean we had, don't get me wrong, we had a lot. 01:26:00 Speaker 3: But yeah, I can remember being. 01:26:04 Speaker 6: Like an early teenager thirteen, fourteen years old or whatever, coming home from school one day and mom said, oh, so and so had a heart attack, and I was like, well, what happened to him? And she said, I think it was just stress. 01:26:18 Speaker 3: And I was like what And she said, he was just stressed out. And I said, what's that mean? What does that mean? Oh? 01:26:29 Speaker 6: And it wasn't anything to do with me. There was everything to do with the two people that raised me. I never heard the word stress. I never heard them say, man, I'm stressed out. This is going wrong, that's going wrong. I mean they were trying to raise two kids. My sister was born with a hold her heart and that's a whole other podcast. I mean, she's a miracle. Yeah, still love today. They dealt with that, but they never talked about being stressed out or it's so bad. 01:27:03 Speaker 2: It was just weren't victims of no, sir. 01:27:05 Speaker 1: It was that happened. 01:27:07 Speaker 6: It was just life and how we dealt with it, how they dealt with it. Oh, and I'm so thankful for that. I mean, looking back on it now, I can look back on it and be like, you know, everybody didn't have the mom and daddy that I did. I mean, it's just playing simple. Everybody didn't, but I sure I'm glad I didn't. 01:27:29 Speaker 1: Yeah, well that's why this was it was Uh, I mean, you know this podcast obviously is focusing on this logging thing, but you're seeing behind it to see little pictures into you guys family. And that's what I noticed right away when I got to know you guys, which I hadn't known you my whole life. I mean, I don't know five or six years ago, Caitlyn we met, but no, y'all really do have so I'm really really special. And I mean your families are strong believers. I knew that right away, which was unique. And then yeah, just the history that you guys have and where y'all live, and I mean, I got a cool story and I'm glad we found a way to kind of share it. And we're kind of just getting started because next episodes all about your dad, yep. And it's really good, this this whole episode. I actually the way I build these is you kind of just like I don't see the whole thing when I start. I mean, even when I'm like, have done all the interviews, I come back here and I listened to every episode, I mean every interview, and I had like two and a half hours of talking that between at your house with your dad and then our stuff at the Global headquarters, and so I just I listened to the whole thing and I just pull out the pieces that I'm just like, that's interesting. I want that in there. I don't know where it's gonna fit. So I started pulled out pieces and stacking them together in like little bricks and blocks, and the whole time I was thinking, Okay, this is all going to Teddy. You know, we got to introduce Teddy. And you know, I like built this whole episode and we hadn't even talked to him yet, and uh, it just you know, and I did that because it was good. I just kept stacking stuff on top of stuff. But but uh, that's good though, because next episode will be and. 01:29:35 Speaker 3: I'm glad you got him. Yeah, you got him going well. 01:29:39 Speaker 6: I mean we've talked about it for years, like with Hillard or other uncle Hillard. 01:29:43 Speaker 1: That's right. 01:29:46 Speaker 3: Why didn't somebody have a tape recorder when he started? 01:29:50 Speaker 6: I mean, I've got like an eight or ten minute video that healer doesn't know what he don't know? 01:29:54 Speaker 3: I got on my phone. 01:29:57 Speaker 6: Yeah, just because one day I just happened to be like, oh, here's my chance. And I've got a couple of different ones of Dad and Frankie Dale together talking about. 01:30:07 Speaker 3: The old time class. Oh do you really like sitting in the truck? Sit down, eat lunch? 01:30:11 Speaker 6: And I would purposely get them going and and i'd hit record on my phone. 01:30:17 Speaker 3: Really, I've got. 01:30:19 Speaker 6: A couple of different twenty men, and one of them is a good one. But we everybody said for years would be like like lit with Grandma. Why didn't somebody record that? 01:30:29 Speaker 3: Well? 01:30:30 Speaker 1: Can I tell them about Hillard when we went over there? 01:30:32 Speaker 3: Yeah? 01:30:33 Speaker 1: Okay, so there Teddy. It is confusing. I've been around enough. I know the story now. But Teddy and Eddie, their dads have an older brother named Hillard, and he is the oldest living brother. There's another brother that's older, but Hillard is eighty seven, eighty seven, still live, still in incredible health in Kaylin last year, sometime two years ago, said uncle hill Lord, I've got a buddy that would like to come interview you and talk to you about talk about Yeah, we're going to talk about Buffalo River when we were Buffalo River episodes. And anyway, I ended up going over there and meeting with him and we put these stinking headsets on him and I did, and I warned you about that before you out there. I know. The thing was is that we I felt like I had some rapport with him. I mean I talked to him and he was warmed up, and he was just seemed to be enjoying himself. And then I was like, man, hey, let's let's go ahead and do this and put this this headset on him. And it was like something shifted. 01:31:46 Speaker 2: Like putting the muzzle on the dogs. 01:31:47 Speaker 1: And he turned to Kaitlin and he just said he I don't want to do this, and uh, and anyway, it was a shame and I was just like, hey, no problem, I don't want you to feel uncomfortable. And I mean he's just a he's just a Hillard's eighty seven, but he's probably fifty years behind the times in terms of just his knowledge of I mean, he's like a guy that you plucked out of the nineteen forties. 01:32:17 Speaker 3: You had a long conversation with him after Yousuk. 01:32:20 Speaker 1: Yeah, he took the headsets off and then talked about all the things we wanted to talk about. He had no problem telling me and just talking to us, but he just didn't want to be recorded. He just was like, I just don't want to be recorded. I mean, yeah, So It's not like we hadn't tried to get Hillard. 01:32:36 Speaker 3: Now. 01:32:37 Speaker 1: Now, Hillard's younger brother also your uncle, Willarard. He loves to be recorded. I don't want to make it sound like he loves to be recorded. But just today, this year, there's going to be a film that comes out about our bear Camp and we made sorghum. I'll show you all a clip of it. Nobody's seen it, but anyway, you're gonna get to see Hillard Vallins, which is y'all's uncle war Willard excuse. 01:33:06 Speaker 4: Me, Willard Junior Willard and any boy boy. 01:33:12 Speaker 1: Yeah that's what. That's what everybody knows me as a sonny boy. But uh so, anyway, yeah, a lot of tie ins with you guys. I mean, getting to know you guys has been just incredible. I mean just it's been a lot of fun. And then our other buddy, my buddy justin House is like y'all's little brother who's. 01:33:30 Speaker 2: Become a good friend of mine. 01:33:32 Speaker 1: Y'all just gang up and whoop him. 01:33:34 Speaker 3: Though. 01:33:35 Speaker 2: My youngest daughter and I he won't even listen to this. 01:33:39 Speaker 1: Whatever you want. 01:33:40 Speaker 2: My youngest daughter and I are going to his house on Sunday, we're gonna ride mules. 01:33:43 Speaker 3: Oh really yep. 01:33:44 Speaker 1: Yeah ah no yeah So anyway, thank you guys, we've been going this is long long time. Well thanks a lot, and uh anything else. Keep the Wild. 01:33:59 Speaker 2: Check out the Real Bear Grease Instagram Real Bear. 01:34:03 Speaker 1: Yeah, we have a new Instagram channel, Page two. I forgotten say that. Yep, yep. See if we can get Hillard Lines to like us on Instagram. If the Wild places wild because that's where the bears live.