00:00:00 Speaker 1: Hello everybody. 00:00:01 Speaker 2: You may have noticed that we did not air an episode of Meat Eater Radio Live yesterday because of the Thanksgiving holiday here in the good old Us of A. So in lieu of that, we decided to drop this bonus Meat Eater Podcast Crew episode. It's Steve and the Gang going over fall hunting stories, some newsybits. It's kind of a throwback, right and it was supposed to come out in December, so you'll hear references to things happening in December, and you can just ignore those because. 00:00:26 Speaker 1: You're listening to it right now. 00:00:27 Speaker 2: And hey, while you're at it, why don't you go on over to the meat Eater dot com where we're having our big Black Friday blowout shale from now through December. First, you can get up to fifty percent savings on things across the entire Meat Eater family of brands. I'm talking First Light, I'm talking Fajef, I'm talking Dave Smith, decoys, I'm talking Phelps game calls, I'm talking the Meat Eater store itself. 00:00:50 Speaker 1: It's a big family. We hope you enjoyed this podcast. 00:00:53 Speaker 2: And more importantly, we hope you are enjoying the holiday. Thank you. 00:01:03 Speaker 3: This is the me Eater podcast coming at you shirtless, severely, bug bitten, and in my case, underwear listeningst You can't predict anything brought to you by First Light. When I'm hunting, I need gear that won't quit. First Light builds, no compromise, gear that keeps me in the field longer, no shortcuts, just gear that works. Check it out at first light dot com. That's f I R S T L I T E dot com. Welcome to the show, everybody, that's a strong welcome. Hell yes, got a great line up here today. We're gonna do a bunch of news. We're gonna do some updates. 00:01:47 Speaker 4: H I have an item, actually, Spencer Newharts here you can continue. 00:01:51 Speaker 3: Fresh off killing a big buck, Randall Williams is here. 00:01:57 Speaker 5: Mm hmm, fresh off and nothing, fresh off of nothing, our breaker, Corey Calkins, I remember you like the Caulkins. 00:02:07 Speaker 3: Better works better for me, Corey Caulkins, fresh off of what. 00:02:11 Speaker 6: Helping some friends fill their freezers? 00:02:14 Speaker 3: Good deal, that's nice deal. Ryan Callahan's you're fresh from killing a big old grizzy well yeah, pretty fresh, well, he said, he wants it. He wants to even bigger one. 00:02:23 Speaker 5: Well parts of me still smell like. 00:02:26 Speaker 3: Wearing you. I've been wearing your waiters around and they're coated in that grease. They're like extra waterproof. Yeah, the water doesn't have a chance to get to the waiter because it's held up by if it gets blocked by grease before it can touch the waiter. 00:02:39 Speaker 4: Yeah, if I may, This seems like a good time happy birth. 00:02:46 Speaker 5: At the point birthday forty three? Are you one forty three? Yeah, that happened on cool Man eighty six. Yeah, I'm gonna take to get kicked out of. 00:03:03 Speaker 3: Phil's here. He's deep, He's neck deep into cratch It. 00:03:06 Speaker 5: The twelfth edition of the Cratchit Report. 00:03:10 Speaker 3: Oh dude, I'm licking my lips. So, since this hasn't released yet, have we already been there? 00:03:16 Speaker 7: This comes out December fifteenth, so. 00:03:18 Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, I've already been Oh and I'm still regularly weird. Yeah it was good. 00:03:26 Speaker 8: Yeah, I got older that night. 00:03:28 Speaker 6: I don't remember that. 00:03:29 Speaker 3: Phil was the only guy that did any good. 00:03:31 Speaker 4: I was on the edge of my seat the whole time wondering which ghost would come out, and. 00:03:35 Speaker 3: Everybody sucked except Phil. 00:03:37 Speaker 2: That's what we're doing this year, is we're changing the order of the we shuffle it every night just to keep people on their toes. 00:03:43 Speaker 3: Yeah, here's the weird This has nothing to do with anything but just the weird ethics question. So so my friend Mercer long sends me this year, well, sends me a pocket knife. Not this sends me a pocket knife with a Daniel Boone quote. Just has a nice little friendship gesture, and it's got the quote I was happy in the midst of dangers and inconveniences, which is a Boon quote. He sends it to me and I promptly lose it. Mm hm turkey hunting. So one year later I go back to where I remember. I remember needing to fix something on a little knob. One year later, I go back to the knob, but I can't remember what knob it was, so I check a couple knobs, never acquire it. Tell him I lost the knife, the Dan and Boone knife. He sends me another one. I'm in Africa and I run into these fellas actually using one of those friction boards to make a fire. They got the spindle in the wood, and I want that thing so bad, but I have nothing to offer for it. So I take Mercer's gift and trade it, and then I feel guilty, So then I went and ordered me up my own. Is that like you know what I'm saying? So is it a real bind? 00:05:12 Speaker 8: If that keeps on giving. 00:05:13 Speaker 3: It's like an ethical bind. 00:05:15 Speaker 7: What's the value of that knife? 00:05:16 Speaker 3: I don't know. 00:05:16 Speaker 5: Yeah, but you could also just say, like I appreciated the gesture so much that I invested in it myself. Yeah, I bought myself. You know, it's also just about you and have bought that on your own had he not started it. 00:05:34 Speaker 3: No, no, no, I wouldn't even thought about. 00:05:35 Speaker 4: It's also super cool that there's a guy in Africa going around with a knife with a Daniel Boone quote on it. 00:05:40 Speaker 3: My kid asked my kid, my little one. He kind of was more. He was into that trade. He liked the politics of that trade, and he was not too long ago asking me if I think that he's kept it sharp and if I think that people have been asking him about it? And I said yes, Well I said no and yes, hmm, yeah, because I don't know how he would. I don't know what he would have to like, he's probably honing it on a wet rock. 00:06:09 Speaker 5: I would think that a big part of their conversation was like, yeah, great, trade chunk of wood for a knife. But we also had to sit through a forty minute explanation of some dude, yeah named Daniel. 00:06:23 Speaker 8: It's like I basically gave away. 00:06:24 Speaker 3: A book of matches. 00:06:25 Speaker 8: You know. 00:06:26 Speaker 3: Oh listen, he didn't hesitate. 00:06:30 Speaker 7: You both were satisfied afterwards. I think you should double down on this. Are you familiar with like the real little red paper clip thing or something someone starts with like a little red paper clip and they trade that for a pen, and then they trade that pill. 00:06:44 Speaker 3: Yeah, my kids always talk about that. 00:06:46 Speaker 7: Yeah, whatever, and eventually they end up with a house. Yeah, yeah, you could do that now, so you would take the wrong direction. No, I don't think he's doing that. You both like elevated yourselves with what you received. 00:06:58 Speaker 3: Oh like if I came to someone and said, yeah, this is this genuine, genuine Yes, this is a genuine h and then you friction board? 00:07:08 Speaker 6: Yeah yeah, do you know the backstory of this fiction be a very valuable friction board. 00:07:13 Speaker 3: Well, I got a picture of the guy. He's a MASSI warrior decked out with a Massi spear, and that's his friction board. And I got a picture of him holding the knife. 00:07:22 Speaker 7: Okay, it's a good start. 00:07:24 Speaker 3: So yeah, man, I'll trade that for what a house? 00:07:26 Speaker 4: Well eventually, yeah whatever one ac you're gonna have to start. 00:07:31 Speaker 7: To get to. So you know, like from now you're gonna have an acre somewhere. 00:07:36 Speaker 3: You know, a lot of news we haven't covered. We haven't done a news shown on time. We're gonna cover off on some interesting news. But but the first bit of news we haven't talked about on the podcast is, uh, Kellahan's big news. Kellahn, you want to explain your big news? Not you, not your bear. 00:07:54 Speaker 5: Yeah. I am the incoming CEO at Backcountry Hunters and Angle, which is is super cool. I start officially January first, and organization I've volunteered with for over a decade at. 00:08:12 Speaker 3: This on the board that long well in various capacities. 00:08:16 Speaker 5: In various capacities, Yeah, exactly, yeah, because yeah, I don't know. There's a lot of rules involving nonprofit boards and how they function, the by laws, so like you can serve so long as just a board member at large, and then you can serve longer if you become a committee chair or you know, boring stuff like that. But yeah, yeah, so I'm I'm super excited and very optimistic for the future of those organizations in general, but BHA specifically, because I think we got a big voice and a lot of good things going for us, non partisan participate particularly. 00:09:01 Speaker 3: I think you're gonna do a good job. 00:09:02 Speaker 8: Man. 00:09:02 Speaker 5: Well, thank you very much. 00:09:04 Speaker 3: I'm looking forward to it. 00:09:04 Speaker 5: A lot to learn, a little scary, a lot of things I don't know, which was kind. 00:09:08 Speaker 4: Of my there's a lot of knobs and switches that you've never seen exactly from your cockpit here exactly. 00:09:14 Speaker 5: And that that's what I told the board when they asked me if i'd be interested in, like, are you guys aware of all the things I don't know? Like Excel spreadsheets, for instance. I hear those are big in CEO circles. So that that was that was super cool to walk through that process with everybody. And you definitely do hear about your faults from a board of people. Oh really, Oh yeah already you've heard about them. Yes, they've already told your faults. 00:09:43 Speaker 3: We don't have enough time. 00:09:46 Speaker 5: Yeah yeah, they're like, so we know you're probably not gonna be good at oh yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, and you're gonna need help with and then eventually you kind of get around to the good stuff. But we think you're gonna be really good at and you should be really good at and and uh yeah, so mostly balanced each other out. But yeah, that was that was That was great. So I'm real excited. And then of course we'll continue to work with all you fellas here, which is kind of having your cake and eat it too, So. 00:10:20 Speaker 3: That will be your mouthpiece. Dude, we need to come and tell people about something. Come and tell them about it. Yeah, Cal's report exactly. 00:10:27 Speaker 8: Who get to sit in this chair? Next time? 00:10:30 Speaker 3: Cal, I get to move up to the important because always sits in it. 00:10:35 Speaker 5: That's gonna be a hard transition for you over the important chair. 00:10:39 Speaker 3: I don't know why he's there right now? 00:10:41 Speaker 7: Is the open one when I came in. 00:10:42 Speaker 5: He's got a really good story. 00:10:43 Speaker 6: He did shoot a big buck. 00:10:45 Speaker 3: Oh that's why he's in that chair. Yeah, I got, I got a bucks, I got, I got, I got a three pack buck story. I'm gonna tell to Cal's can talk about his bear and I'm gonna tell about my three pack buck story. Blood trails. If you got he's been listening to blood Trails. The podcast it's been doing great man. A lot of people listening to Blood Trails. And one thing we get into Blood Trails all the missing bodies, and what's totally weird about it is Krin finds this article. Well, let me first. Blood Trails is a crime series. It's all outdoor like, like murders, missing people, all the outdoor hunting and fishing twists. So it's like murder mysteries and other things. Cold cases that involve outdoor characters, hunting trips, various things. The first one we ever did was we did one on a guy that was found by his hunting partners dead shot in the back next to his turkey decoys. We did one on a guy and Maine kills a buck, clear tracks in the snow, drags the buck out to a road. There's tracks in the snow where a car pulled up, like hey, can we give you some help. They can tell from trail action to snow that the guy loaded the buck, that the buck was loaded into a car, the buck and the man never to be seen again. There's all these twisted turns. There's a Blood Trails about a guy guy in Wisconsin meeting his buddy to go hunting. His car weirdly turns up with the wheels gone near one of his hunting spots, but not where he was supposed to meet his buddy, and not when body never found. So that's a series you can go subscribe to and listen. But then here's a crazy thing that Krin sends me, like a newsblit here, the Minnesota Department of Public Safety is asking hunters to be extra vigilant during the firearm opening. This is a news alert right not only looking for deer, but also for signs of missing people. Basically saying, Hey, a bunch of people out in the woods, run around weird places, keep your eyes out. Four discarded clothing in areas where it doesn't belong, or bones that do not appear to be from animals, like a little announcement they made. Do not touch any of the items, Take photographs if possible, save location on a GPS, drop a pin called cops. 00:13:36 Speaker 5: I bet I know where some bodies are disappeared too, just because I feel like everybody here probably has the same thought process when you come across certain spots where you're like, yeah, boy, if I ever had to. 00:13:51 Speaker 7: Yeah, when a body does turn up, somewhere. I usually think the opposite, like that's the best you could do for hiding a body. 00:13:58 Speaker 3: Nor McDonald has a big bit about that, like the Haiti, the hastily dug grave. 00:14:03 Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, it's a great one. 00:14:06 Speaker 3: Yeah, he's got a bit about that where he's like, if he was gonna kill someone, he'd start out by digging a really deep hole. Yeah, thoroughly grave. Yeah, because he said they always leave it as an afterthought. Yeah, this is where we're combining humor. We're putting in humor where it doesn't belong. Yeah, missing people, but that's what comedians do. 00:14:27 Speaker 7: This genre of podcasts is like quite popular now and you know mediators doing its own spin on it, and there are now multiple examples of podcasters helping solve some of these crimes that were cold cases. So like listen, blood trails and maybe something, uh, you know will make sense for you. 00:14:45 Speaker 3: We're gonna do some follow up because we've already had some interesting things come in there. 00:14:49 Speaker 5: It's just just another way the hunting community helps the general public at large. Service we do for all of you who don't. 00:15:01 Speaker 3: You know what here's one do you know that that this year Japan has had ten brown bear fatalities. Yeah, yeah, they've had one hundred. Japan has had one hundred brown bear attacks, ten fatalities. Wow, listen to this. I don't want to pull this up. I was pulling up a news bit about it. You're trying to do it, Corey put that in near little thing. I'm abou there they really see here's where news. This is news gone bad. Play this clip. Philip probably say you can't for some stupid reason. Yeah, for sure, mister no, no, did you call your lawyers yet? You know I was reading the other day that actors aren't artists. 00:15:49 Speaker 1: Oh okay, I'll take that. Ye thanks. 00:15:52 Speaker 3: That had an opinion piece or it was in the comments section to a thing, and he was he raised the rise points. They don't write their own lines, they don't pick their own costume, they don't do what they want to do. They gotta do what the director says. Not artists. I thought about phil. 00:16:05 Speaker 2: All right, I don't even have a quippi retort to that stevel just. 00:16:13 Speaker 3: Because no one wrote it for him, that's right, that was good. Did they have to write it for him and he had to rehearse it? 00:16:21 Speaker 5: Maybe you need to sit in a Dungeons and Dragons game with Phil. I appreciate his art. 00:16:26 Speaker 3: Did you can you pull it up? 00:16:27 Speaker 6: That link just goes to gmail. 00:16:30 Speaker 5: All right, good deal, but you can google it. 00:16:33 Speaker 4: But those brown bear attacks keep everybody, keep everybody entertaining. 00:16:37 Speaker 5: H brown bears right like they we we think about them in the American context. But there who stopped breaking them all over? You don't have to go all that far Italy to get attacked by a brown bear. That's not a place people associate with brown bears. 00:16:56 Speaker 3: Here we go to this. 00:17:00 Speaker 5: Bears this year and Time reports the government is taking unusual steps to reduce the threat. 00:17:08 Speaker 8: Japan is grappling with the grizzly. 00:17:12 Speaker 3: That's all I wanted to include there. What a cheap shot, clever whoever wrote that Japan is grappling with a grizzly problem. 00:17:21 Speaker 8: That's bad? 00:17:24 Speaker 3: But my god, Yeah, one hundred attacks and ten ten like Japan. I'm no geographer. It is not a large island. The cause, I don't know. I haven't really listened to many bears, A lot of bears, a lot of people. 00:17:43 Speaker 7: Yeah, one of them happened inside a supermarket. 00:17:47 Speaker 3: You think like grizzlies. So if you take Alaska in the lower forty eight. So if you basically Alaska, Wyoming, Montana, Idaho, grizzlies kill a couple of people year max. Yeah, maybe ten ten in Japan and the hundred attacks, that's wild yep. 00:18:08 Speaker 5: Yeah, And they just pull point to Japan has a hunting culture, it's shrinking, it's aging. I think overall, Japan is still considered to be way too old. They're trying to reverse that trend, right, like the population average is aging, and with that they're losing all sorts of cultural things, hunting being one of them. And one of the theories is that you have a disarmed, olding, aging population that doesn't interact with wildlife the way it historically has, and the brown bears have figured it out mm hmmm, and they're they're taking advantage. And there's there's just areas that villages places, rural commun unities on the outskirts that have a way smaller population than they historically have. And so you know, because of that, bears aren't having as much human interference, but they're interacting with human things and and that's where the conflict is occurring. 00:19:22 Speaker 4: When Steve asked you to fill time, why did you start talking about Italy when you know everything there. 00:19:28 Speaker 8: Is to know about the Japan situation. 00:19:30 Speaker 5: Well, I just think that we have had a full clip back there because I had started writing this thing about like why people should care about like our disappearing grasslands in America Bureau of Land Management lands in general, and how unique the American pronghorn antelope is, and being fresh off this brown bear hunt, I'm like, you know, brown bears are amazing, and people think about brown bears all the time, and like brown bears aren't nearly as American, you could say, not American. 00:20:07 Speaker 3: Like rather circumpolar, right, you know. 00:20:10 Speaker 5: And and here's the place that you can find them, and here's the places where they are, Like I wouldn't consider them like crazy wild animals, right, And it's like they're pretty damn close to the Vatican. Yeah, that doesn't seem to. 00:20:25 Speaker 3: Go hand in hand, you know, American. 00:20:30 Speaker 7: One of the things they're blaming it on is a poor acorn harvest, which also happened in twenty twenty three. So the bears are winding up in places where humans are steal their food instead. 00:20:42 Speaker 3: It's good to have Spencer here, man. Yeah, a lot of guys come in this room. You know, they're all lazy. They don't look anything. 00:20:47 Speaker 8: Up fine blind Yeah, he's like this guy was his mouth, he's got some gold. 00:20:53 Speaker 3: No about Italy. 00:20:55 Speaker 5: That was right, just put artificial intelligence in there. 00:21:00 Speaker 6: It sounds like they deployed their self defense forces to take care of this problem. I don't know of any update beyond that, though. 00:21:08 Speaker 5: They also have a pretty serious bear spray distribution program. Really yeah, and uh they're the robot dog thing. 00:21:16 Speaker 1: There's all. 00:21:19 Speaker 5: They're they're getting technology out there and then there you can borrow cans of bear spray and return them and stuff. So there's they're working on it. 00:21:28 Speaker 3: It's so funny about bear spray culture. I've been noticing a lot around here bear spray culture. It's like a whole culture bear. Yeah. If people go it's so funny, Like people go to a trailhead around here. Let's you're gonna go hike up to them. Half people hike up the m hill. Guy can bear spray. There's a lion up there. Well I don't, but hear me out. Hear me out on our ring like our ring camera. There's a bear every two nights. Really, my neighbor has a bear every night there's I was walking on there. Now, I was walking aro done by the golf course of my kids. Bears shit everywhere. Golfers don't have bear spray when you go out to take your kids to school. Like when people walk out to take their kids to school and get in their car, they don't have bear spray. 00:22:14 Speaker 8: There's certain activities. 00:22:16 Speaker 3: Yeah, why is it that people? Yeah, that's right, that's good. People bring it according to what they're doing. It's an accessory, not according to. 00:22:24 Speaker 5: What the odds are, like what the bears do to the Bear Convention of eighteen seventy three. 00:22:32 Speaker 3: They're like hiking bear spray being around bears. 00:22:35 Speaker 5: Now, the Council of Gallison degreed this. Well, I told you way back in my construction crew days. This guy that we worked with, he'd put his family on speakerphone and they would call because they would often end the call with now, remember, don't get off the pavement. The bears don't. They don't like the pavement. 00:23:00 Speaker 7: Every two nights, what's that every two nights? 00:23:03 Speaker 3: I'm exaggerating a lot. Well, when when the child cherries come in, Oh, when the child cherry's come in, But you eat my neighbor who's right there. You should you should talk to him. I'm not exaggerated a bout my neighbor. Every call him and ask him some bit. Right now? 00:23:23 Speaker 7: Do they mess with garbage lot? 00:23:24 Speaker 3: It just comes through eating show cherries, messing with garbage their day. His wife had to show it off in the middle of the day, trying to get it out of there, probably without bear spray. 00:23:32 Speaker 4: When we lived in Missoula, we like our house and our neighbor's house used to be an old orchard, so there's all these apple trees and plumb trees and everything. And yeah, there's like two months of the year where there'd be bears in the trash every night or just out in the yard and they just roam like the rattlesnak neighborhood sort of at will. 00:23:53 Speaker 8: But nobody's carrying bear spray. 00:23:56 Speaker 3: Uh. 00:23:56 Speaker 4: He came through somebody's house. Actually, they're like sitting on the back and a bear came Do you remember that story? 00:24:03 Speaker 5: Followed the dog through the house just like came in. 00:24:05 Speaker 8: One door and came out the other door. 00:24:08 Speaker 7: You know what I learned about Missoula this year that I bet this room has a lot of input on, is that the feral horses that live in town that are so crazy. 00:24:18 Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, yeah, And I think the story there is like outfitter went bust and just cut his pack string lose. 00:24:25 Speaker 7: How long ago, I don't know when when I when I heard that they were like in town, I didn't think literally in town, like standing. 00:24:32 Speaker 4: On it used to be that areas like really grown in the past ten years. But yeah, it's like it used to be a more rural that looks more threatening than a bear. 00:24:44 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:24:46 Speaker 5: Yeah, I shouldn't be there. 00:24:54 Speaker 3: Here's a Tennessee guy, Tennessee man has runs into that problem where you know when you see Giant Bucks where you're now supposed to chase him. Do you hear about this guy? So he gets wind of a or he's probably seeing this giant buck running around Giant Bucks. I mean, now I'm blocked out of this damn thing. I'm in the Tennessee. Yeah. So there's this very distinctive buck with some drop tins and stuff like that, and all of a sudden, there he is, and he's got it. He's got pictures of it out well. The prison guard, the local prison guard says, hey, I know that buck. He lives at the prison. They go and check this guy's house out. He's got three bucks he killed on the prison. What's interesting about the news article in the Tennessee and is it instead of talking about how big any of them is, it gives you the combine kind the score of all three bucks. 00:26:02 Speaker 7: Yeah, which and then you have to do one hundred sixty three inches. 00:26:06 Speaker 3: Yeah. So it's like it says he killed three bucks totally, well, four hundred ninety one inches. If you imagine, like, like, first off, we'll talk about the story in a minute, but I just saw if you imagine like your average person reading the tennesseean, yeah, and you tell them he killed three bucks. 00:26:32 Speaker 7: Totaling four hundred ninety one inches, what. 00:26:37 Speaker 3: Is the level of like, oh, you know, like the reader, what is their level of? 00:26:44 Speaker 8: Or the editor was just like this graph is too long, let's just add them all up. 00:26:49 Speaker 3: Yeah. I just kind of get lost in all the numbers and we talking about how they all the dear arcas add him up. Yeah, so he killed he kept quote Oh no, no, this is a quote from the actual Lauderdale County General Sessions Judge Judge Lovelace like that name, he said, quote, the three bucks had a combined gross score, not net quote. The three Bucks had a combined gross score of four hundred and ninety one and five eighths inches. 00:27:31 Speaker 8: This just sounds ripe for a a screenplay. 00:27:36 Speaker 4: Yeah, the scheme, the scheme to break into the prison, taunt the big bucks. 00:27:40 Speaker 3: Yeah, fifty three year old man, God man, I can totally relate to that guy. 00:27:46 Speaker 5: It just goes to two years. 00:27:47 Speaker 3: I would picture hunted to a prison. It's like a height where it was to have to break. 00:27:54 Speaker 5: I know I shouldn't do this, but for those in the room, listeners, block your ears. Just watched Corey Caulkins look this place up and drop not just a pan, but a white tail buck PM on the correctional facility. 00:28:11 Speaker 3: It was more for you. 00:28:12 Speaker 8: What is the what does the perimeter look like? 00:28:20 Speaker 3: I'm gonna make a movie. It's called Ocean's One. It's just one dude trying to kill bucks off the prison. 00:28:27 Speaker 6: It's a beautiful piece of ground. 00:28:29 Speaker 3: It's an amazing he's got some amazing bucks there. That I appreciate about the article is it's trying to like it's so the article says, uh, where's this thing? 00:28:39 Speaker 5: Is Corey thinking? One day if I ever go to Tennessee or one day I never get thrown in prison. 00:28:45 Speaker 3: Tennessee Wildlife Resource Agency Lieutenant Tim Ward, Tennessee Wildlife Resource Agency Lieutenant Tim Ward heard reports in January that a fifteen point double drop time than the article includes a very helpful parenthetical meaning some of the antlers point down was shot in Lauderdale County. Lieutenant Ward was familiar with this deer as it had been spotted frequently around the West Tennessee State Penitentiary. We're hunting is prohibited now if you had to go to jail, Let's say you're a big hunter, they throw you into the whoscal. That's worse than being in jail. As you look out your little barred window and that's son of a business, you patterned him out the window. 00:29:36 Speaker 5: Also with that description, when you hang a buck up on your gambrels, are they all drop times? Look at all the drop on that Look at the drop times on that buck right there holding him. 00:29:51 Speaker 6: Yeah, it looks like it's a chain link fence around the perimeter. So yeah, I'm sure some inmates were watching those deer. 00:29:56 Speaker 4: I mean, I do think we should offer the disclaimer that we're all well aware that these deer were likely outside of the perimeter. 00:30:02 Speaker 8: And yeah, it's much more fun to entertain that scenario. But I just don't think. I don't want to get a bunch of messages on Instagram saying you idiot. 00:30:12 Speaker 3: Yeah, No, I understand. Yeah, you know, like the part of the prison where the bad guys kind of whisper and stuff about, like in the yard further crime they're gonna do you know. Yeah, in the movies, I don't think that's where the buck knows. 00:30:24 Speaker 8: He's not by the he's not by the bench press in the basketball. 00:30:30 Speaker 3: No, he's not there, man, He's off like in the area where the prisoner gets away. Yeah, exactly where he's gonna hide. 00:30:35 Speaker 8: Where the searchlights shine into. 00:30:37 Speaker 3: No, I don't carry bear spray just because there's a black bear in the vicinity. But if I was hunting there, because you don't know when a guy's gonna bust the who's coal, Yeah, and there you are. 00:30:48 Speaker 6: I will say this butts up against public land. 00:30:51 Speaker 3: Right exactly. But that double drop time there's somebody right now that's just upset with you, so upset it's so public knowledge. I mean, he's got he's got a buck. That's like a beautiful typical, that crazy drop tyner. He's got the other one with some real junk on it, some little kickers here and there. They don't explain kickers in the article. 00:31:12 Speaker 5: I I this is embarrassing to say, but I definitely had a reaction of like, I mean, it's just the greed man, Like this guy had this little illegal thing figured out. 00:31:28 Speaker 3: I don't know, well, or is he thinking he's like, here these here's these deer. First off, he's thinking these people are supposed to be in jail instead of looking at Giant Bucks. 00:31:46 Speaker 6: Ye, take that right away, do you know what I mean? 00:31:49 Speaker 3: Like, like they're doing their they committed and now they committed, should they have the joy heinous crimes? And now they get to look at Giant Bucks. And I don't m so that might be what he's thinking. 00:32:01 Speaker 4: I'm thinking of casting a Channing Tatum type for the lead in this film, not a real artist, with someone with a sense of humor who can also be sort of a dashing action hero. 00:32:13 Speaker 5: Sure, that's I agreed, because the guy he wasn't like. I have a combined gross amount of antler of four hundred and ninety one for my secret hunting spot I should call it quits now, or I shouldn't tell anybody. 00:32:30 Speaker 7: He did it successfully enough that he was comfortable getting two of these deer shoulder mounted, which is like kind of a high profile thing that happens if you go get a deer shoulder mounted. 00:32:40 Speaker 5: Yeah, you're like, he's not a home folks know. 00:32:44 Speaker 8: Yeah, one on the right is a deer that should be in a on a T shirt. 00:32:50 Speaker 3: Clay did one about a guy that killed one on a military base illegally. He claimed that when he saw he just lost his mind. Susie. As soon as he shot it, he said, I said to myself, I'll never get away with this, but in temporary insanity. 00:33:06 Speaker 6: Wow. 00:33:07 Speaker 3: We interviewed a guy one time, the game warden from Idaho, former game He was a game ward at the time. Eric. Uh, you know they put those robo deer out. They don't use giants, you use mediums. He was saying, if you push it to using giants, everyone shoots at it. 00:33:33 Speaker 1: So then they want to get the real. 00:33:38 Speaker 7: Case. 00:33:39 Speaker 3: They use mediums because they're worried that it's like entrapman. Shoo, Yeah, it's entrapman. You're baiting the trap with two enticing of a bait, so you bait it with a medium. 00:33:52 Speaker 8: Wow makes sense. 00:33:54 Speaker 3: You know. 00:33:56 Speaker 5: I was working with Jordan Seillers to go back to blood trails because there's an Idaho judge who's now retired who several game wardens referred to as a hanging judge when it came to wildlife crime. Oh, and so I'm trying to get that fellow track down so Jordan can talk to him, because I'm like, if that's the case, I'm sure he's got some fun stories that might fit for Jordan Sillers. 00:34:25 Speaker 3: That's interesting. I have a friend in law enforcement and he has a heart. He generally has a hard time. He generally has a hard time with wildlife crimes that come to juris or wildlife crimes. Yeah, with judges where a lot of them are like what now a deer? Like what? Yep? Exactly, I've had to talk about a deer. 00:34:49 Speaker 5: Yeah, several conversations with prosecutors, county prosecutors who have known through friends and family and stuff, who have eventually been like, hey, can you tell me why when a game word brings a case into our office that they are so serious about it? 00:35:11 Speaker 3: Because you're not. 00:35:13 Speaker 5: Yeah, because it's like, well, by the they've done a lot of work and they have to like cross this line of like, Okay, this is consuming a lot of resources and time, it is worth it, and so they need it to be worth it to you or else it's it's a giant waste of time. And they're picking and choosing like what is going to make the biggest impact and and and and that's why. And they know that all these prosecutors are like, oh, here's some truly gross human stuff drugs or trafficking or you know, you name it. And they're like, and you're worried about a white tail deer. 00:35:59 Speaker 8: Right that the guy just shot it after dark? 00:36:02 Speaker 3: Yeah right, yeah, but so he could have legally killed it twenty minutes earlier. But but your works he killed it. Yeah yeah. But then then at the same time, that's the game wardens mandate. Yeah. 00:36:13 Speaker 4: I think we should have like a version of a military tribunal for wildlife violations. 00:36:21 Speaker 5: And who would be on there just old game wardens. 00:36:25 Speaker 8: Yeah, like people who get it. 00:36:28 Speaker 3: That's a good point, man, Yeah, like change the constitution and stuff. 00:36:33 Speaker 8: Yeah, you know, there's like a traffic court. 00:36:36 Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a couple of other tweaks. Yeah, tweaks people have been talking about in the Constitution. That might be a good one, while like a little what do you call when you add on to that sucker amendment? 00:36:47 Speaker 4: Well, yeah, I mean a jury of your peers. For a hunter to be tried by a bunch of non hunters, I feel like it's not your peers. 00:36:54 Speaker 3: More constitutional tourneys. The jury of your peers should be that. Yeah, your peers. Well they might be like, well, I'm a poacher, so my peers. 00:37:06 Speaker 5: The other important in wildlife crime is there's no intent, you know, like human crime, it's like, well, obviously they were intending this because of their these previous actions and things, and then your witnesses in the woods, don't they never end up taking the stand right? 00:37:25 Speaker 3: Yeah, No, it's true because then you're The question with wildlife crime too, is like, you know, they always get into motive. Yeah, what was the motive? He wanted that big old box. Yeah, he wanted a really big buck. That's about that. 00:37:42 Speaker 8: Yeah, that's what it was. 00:37:44 Speaker 7: A couple of backstraps. 00:37:47 Speaker 3: Uh, here's one. It's like, you can spend an hour on this. I'd actually like to spend an hour on this. So in California. This is a complicated Two former ranch properties were recently returned to the Tully River Indian Tribe. The tribe's ancestral lands straddle the foothills of present day Tulare County. Am I saying that right, Tulair County. 00:38:18 Speaker 8: Yeah. 00:38:21 Speaker 3: The land return was funded through the California Natural Resources Agency, the agency's Tribal Nature based Solutions program. So there was these ranches that were somehow under California control, and they did a land back thing and granted the ranches to the tribe. Because the ranches connect the tribal reservation lands to public lands, to US Forest Service lands, they promptly turn around and put a bunch of wildlife enhancement efforts place and start uh to Leelkurd on their land. That's interesting. 00:39:11 Speaker 5: Very much, So I will admit I didn't read that one, but uh, you can. 00:39:16 Speaker 3: Spend there's two huge elements here, the land back, the land back movement. That'd be like Krin's not here. Well, I think if Krin was here, I'd be telling he she you know, she's here doing her job. I'm not hunting. I wondered telling her about how we should do something on land back. 00:39:36 Speaker 5: Is it specifically land back or was it a scenario where there were the state wanted to get rid of this stuff for all the reasons states do and there were several entities in the running. Or was this a specific agreement with the tribe that had lasted forever. 00:39:56 Speaker 3: That's what I don't know. So from San Francisco Gate dot com, s F dot com, tuliuk a once again roaming the Sierra Nevada Foothills southwest of Sequoia and Kings Canyon National Parks after a historic land return that Governor Gavin Newsom is calling the largest of its kind in the region's history. The seventeen thy thirty acres, made up of two former ranch properties, were recently returned to the Tuley River Indian tribe. Interesting The land return was funded through the California Natural Resource Agencies Tribal Nature Based Solutions Program, which partners with tribes across the state to place the stewardship of ancestral land back in indigenous hands. 00:40:48 Speaker 5: Yeah, I definitely fits. 00:40:50 Speaker 3: Have you on that language. Mm, so that's a subject and then tule Elka is a subject. Neither of those subjects we've really ever taken on the show. We're Karen here doing her job. I would put that she'd put that on her little for Phil. 00:41:08 Speaker 1: Yeah, I've already got it jotted. 00:41:09 Speaker 3: Down here and it maybe put a sticky note where she should be sitting right What your your but mate? What you missed? 00:41:19 Speaker 7: She said that you gave her a hall pass to elk hunt today instead of coming to the podcast. 00:41:24 Speaker 8: What was that conversation? 00:41:26 Speaker 6: Like? 00:41:26 Speaker 3: She texted me? And basically it was like what time yesterday? It was basically like, are you a good person or a bad person? 00:41:37 Speaker 8: Yeah? 00:41:38 Speaker 3: I suppose I could come back if I really needed to. 00:41:42 Speaker 6: For the record, I could be hunting right now. 00:41:44 Speaker 3: Do you follow me? I supposed to. Well. 00:41:48 Speaker 7: When Karin sent out this invite, Cal's response was Krinn, that is the best day of the mule. Dear rut, No, it's not November twelve, begged to fight about it. It is Col's birthday, So me, Randall and Corey will decide which day is better? Which day is better? 00:42:06 Speaker 3: Steve? 00:42:08 Speaker 7: Sorry if he says November twelve, what's your answer? 00:42:12 Speaker 3: Nineteen? 00:42:13 Speaker 7: November nineteen. 00:42:16 Speaker 2: Is that because that's when you specifically will be out out and about and you're just trying to hype yourself. 00:42:22 Speaker 3: I'm out in about when I think it's the best day. 00:42:25 Speaker 1: Okay, chicken egg situation, here's a good one, Corey. 00:42:31 Speaker 7: Which day is better Thanksgiving? Oh wow? 00:42:36 Speaker 3: So the deer know what's a Thursday? 00:42:38 Speaker 6: And nobody's out there, especially in the afternoon. 00:42:42 Speaker 3: Three. It's like Wisconsin. Them the packers are playing dude yourself on the neighbor's place. Used to be able to till trail cameras, that's my understanding. I don't know what the motive. That's what Wisconsin guys say, Like, prior to trail cams, you could your neighbors, you could drive your neighbors property during packers games. You never get caught. Now you can get caught. This is what I've been told about wisconsinights. It's a hot tip. So this guy was digging. He was into the deep cuts. He's back listening to episode seven seven seven. Oh no, what am I saying? That's not a deep cut? He was listening to a recent episode. He says, how we were talking about the South Carolina d n r's use of the term still hunts. Remember we talked about this random A guy wrote in he moves to South Carolina and he's reading the South Carolina rags and he sees that there's there, there's a thing in the South Carolina deer egs where there's a tight there's a distinction, a still hunt. He reads that how most people in America would read it a still hunt being very slowly, very quietly making your way through prime deer country, not sitting still. So it's a misnomer. But like, few steps stop and listen, few steps stop and listen, that's called still honey. Why that's called still honey, I don't know. It should be called slow walk hunting, timber creeping, timber creeping, But still honey. If you go get like old hunting books, any kind of hunting books, whatever, that is still honting, slow deliberate travel, few steps, stop and listen, few steps stop and listen, that's called still hunting. 00:44:28 Speaker 5: If you're walking slightly faster and you're Doug Duran, it's called a moon. 00:44:34 Speaker 3: Yes. Well, if there are people stand hunting nearby, you could spend a long time explaining all these distinctions. Hey, this guy moves to South Carolina and he's like, you can only still hunt. He's looking at his rags. This is still hunting. Season, He no joke, calls the Fishing Game Agency to be like, why can't you hunt? Why can't I sit in my tree stand? And they're like, no, you idiot, still hunting here means hunting, not with dogs. Okay. A guy writes in here's another one from South Carolina that kind of like is tricky. You cannot possess any deer with the head. Sorry, you may not. Okay. Here's the rule. Possessing any deer with the head detached while in transit from the point of kill is prohibited, meaning if you're in South Carolina and you kill one, often in a swamp, he realized he is not allowed to part that deer out. You have to take the deer outthole. You can't transport a deer, and he says, he's wondering, what if I leave its head attached to like its front arm by a flap of hide. 00:45:56 Speaker 8: Yeah I don't. 00:45:58 Speaker 3: Is that a weird one? Yeah, very cannot. You cannot take a dearer part in the woods, and. 00:46:04 Speaker 5: You would have to because there are you know, it's very random, but there's doze that get little antlers and your sale doesn't say you need to leave evidence of sex, right, right, Like, in general, the head would be evidence of sex, but not always. 00:46:21 Speaker 6: That must be what they're referring to. 00:46:22 Speaker 3: Well, yeah, but in Montana, evidence of sex doesn't count the head. Back when it was the rule, they changed the rule recently and Montana had to be you had to leave evidence of sex attached. You could remove the genitals, you can move the that, you could remove the mammories, the packer, the vulb or whatever. It could all be removed. You could have the head still attached. You could still get a ticket. 00:46:46 Speaker 7: M m. 00:46:47 Speaker 3: Yeah. They were like, the head doesn't tell us enough. We need to see. I was one time getting. 00:46:52 Speaker 5: Evidence of sex defined ass. 00:46:54 Speaker 3: I was issued a warning. Shortly after moving to Montana. I had a game ward and issue me a warning and it was really nice, and get me a note in case another game ward and try to get yell at me for the same thing. Anyways, I'm like, put the head's on it. He's like, man, doesn't cut it. Yeah, doesn't cut it. You gotta leave the sexual organs attached. He doesn't care about that. The head could be gone. They just want the sexual organs. So in this case, that's just a weird one to me. So this guy's lived he's lived elsewhere then moved to South Carolina. So the way he normally goes about things he can't go about. 00:47:27 Speaker 4: The other interesting thing here is like, I know in Montana, it defies says like or it maybe not in Montana, but in somewhere you know, they say where you're going. It's like from the point of kill until where it's processed, or from point of kill until you get home or whatever. This is just well in transit from the point of kill. So could you take it to your buddy's house down the road then cut the head off right and uh, and then take it home right? 00:47:54 Speaker 5: It's like it no longer from the point of kill. 00:47:56 Speaker 4: Yeah, Like it just has a starting point for where the head can't be attached, but it doesn't have the end point. 00:48:02 Speaker 8: What when can you detach the head. 00:48:04 Speaker 4: Or drag it fifty yards right exact Ye, I'm gonna drag it over there, take a long break. 00:48:09 Speaker 8: It's attached to the head. 00:48:11 Speaker 5: Steve, a buddy of mine, was also given a warning for not leaving evidence of sex on a on a dough that he killed from years ago. Yeah and uh, And he had like a full on dispute at. This is at a hunter's check station on the road because he had left the memories and cut off the teats. Right, I'd fully skinned. 00:48:34 Speaker 3: The deer, left the memory. 00:48:37 Speaker 5: Well, that was the the game warden was was in the wrong on this one. And my buddy had a biology degree and was like, he's like, I'm not accepting a warning. He's like, you're wrong. 00:48:53 Speaker 7: It's got to be the first time that's ever had. 00:48:54 Speaker 5: He's like, this is evidence of sex. He's like, a teat is a feature, mammory is a gland. It was like, let's let's how much time do you. 00:49:05 Speaker 3: Haring it on? Bring it on? I'm lawyered up. Some years ago, Montana got a friend of mine joke that Montana got rid of all the rules that were the most commonly broken rules. Where Montana ditched. They loosened wanton waste restrictions yeap, so that you can just breast a bird out, so you can just breast out game birds and not have to do the legs. They got rid of want, they got rid of evidence of sex. 00:49:38 Speaker 8: I was attached. 00:49:40 Speaker 3: Yeah, I was supportive of the evidence of sex. Move I was not supportive of the wanton waste loosening. 00:49:49 Speaker 6: Yeah, you can leave a bear carcass in the woods. 00:49:51 Speaker 3: Now, can you really the whole damn thing? 00:49:55 Speaker 5: Hm? 00:49:55 Speaker 3: Wouldn't they do that? 00:49:57 Speaker 6: You could just take the hide? 00:49:58 Speaker 3: No way, No, that's when that happened. 00:50:01 Speaker 6: Well, forever there was carcass and hide tags they didn't give you. Now it's just one tag. 00:50:07 Speaker 3: You can get to all the meat. Yeah, you don't have no, no, no, that's not sure. 00:50:11 Speaker 5: Well you don't have to attach a tag to any meat, don't. 00:50:14 Speaker 3: I think there still want waste regulations on bears. Hold on, looked that up. 00:50:18 Speaker 7: That's got I'm not going to give out wrong information. 00:50:22 Speaker 5: I really don't pay attention to that because I'm bringing it all out anyway. When we were we were working with Idaho Fishing Game to get their want waste laws updated, and I was talking I was getting all the stakeholders together, right, So I was talking to like Idaho houndsman and trappers and everybody, and nine of the phone calls I made, people would be like, wait, now you don't have to take the meat. 00:50:49 Speaker 3: Oh really? Yeah. It was just like. 00:50:53 Speaker 5: It seemed like everybody who was really doing it was taking the meat anyway, which was interesting and very good to hear. 00:50:59 Speaker 3: Yeah, if I was king of the world, I'd make really strict want sauce. There's there's hunting units in Alaska where you're obligated to bring out like moose ribs and liver. Yeah, on the bone. I don't know about liver currently, but they had some the bone. Yeah, they had somewhere like you couldn't in certain units you couldn't bone them. But Alaska does extremes too, Like they have certain units where you have to destroy the trophy value of a moose. You have to draw a special tag to keep the antlers. Yeah, if you're hunting it under under normal like registration rules, you have to destroy. When we're hunting, was super interesting. We're hunting this spring, hunting bears the spring. I found first time in my life I found a moose. I found a well, you know, you gotta saw. They show you where you gotta cut through the you gotta cut through the paddle. And I found a sawed through just one portion. I found the outer extent, the outer portion of a sawd through half of paddle. Could you then, I didn't even know. That's a great question. I did not. That's a great question. But I didn't even know I was in one of those units. I'm like, oh my god, I've never even seen one of these. But here's where a guy killed one doing a registration hunt and had to destroy the trophy value of the moose and there was sowed and half. 00:52:16 Speaker 5: That's amazing. 00:52:16 Speaker 3: Yeah, it was wild and a pain in the butt. 00:52:19 Speaker 5: I was cutting. I made beautiful. One of the things that really excites me about antelope rad is like they're just so easy to deal with, and so I bring bring everything, everything, and I was sawing through the spine and making like, you know, like actual bone end. State Cuts made these gorgeous little porterhouses this year, and what I don't. 00:52:46 Speaker 3: Know what that is. I know that it's like a good thing to order, but I don't know what, Like, what the hell is the porterhouse? 00:52:50 Speaker 5: Well, the porterhouse? Is this the portion where the loin and the tender loin are you know the loins on top tender loins under the porterhouse? Yep, yep, So yeah, one chunk. 00:53:03 Speaker 8: No, I just I just knew that. 00:53:05 Speaker 4: At Outback Steakhouse, DA used to call the porterhouse the Melbourne and it was the biggest stick you could get. 00:53:09 Speaker 3: A great trivia question for your ass. 00:53:11 Speaker 7: I don't think so. 00:53:13 Speaker 8: I don't think they call it the do we need to. 00:53:15 Speaker 5: Go through the ones that are bad anyhow, and just cutting through I mean a dinky little antelope. It is like that was a lot of work with a handsaw. And then man antlers are hard and cutting through a moose antler would be a deterrent. 00:53:37 Speaker 3: And the end of the butcher was bragging out to me two days ago. No, wh wasn't she bragging up to me? She was bragging out to me two days ago about how fun her band saw is. That's the word she used. Yeah, she says, it's a lot of fun. 00:53:49 Speaker 5: It's a dream. 00:53:50 Speaker 3: It's fun to have a band. 00:53:51 Speaker 5: It's a dream. Yeah. Way back when, uh, when I was running around with my old outfitter, we would in the middle of the day go down and cut beef in Stevensville at a buddy's butcher shop. And you'd always end the day by going, Now, you know a job you don't want to do. But yeah, running steaks through that band saw is you get all that meat butterflying out? 00:54:15 Speaker 3: It's great? 00:54:16 Speaker 7: Corey, how's googling? 00:54:17 Speaker 6: You're facing conflicting It would be conflicting theg Yeah, well that's what I'm trying to look up because I knew it was pretty reach. 00:54:26 Speaker 5: The deer and elkregs, Like, I know, there's no longer anything that mentions rib meat. But you said, what about neck and shanks? 00:54:34 Speaker 3: No, my understanding is no ribs, no neck, no shanks. 00:54:37 Speaker 8: It's four quarters, tenderlining, backstrap. 00:54:41 Speaker 7: I believe they say tender loin in there. 00:54:44 Speaker 8: I believe. 00:54:44 Speaker 7: So that's a funny one, Like you gotta take that well, I. 00:54:50 Speaker 5: Mean just I have been around some people whose interpretation of a front quarter. 00:54:57 Speaker 3: Yeah, the quarter is. 00:55:01 Speaker 5: Like, oh, you're you're leaving. You're basically just taking the bones out, some fatty bone and some meaty, fatty bones because they're cutting. 00:55:10 Speaker 8: Oh they're cutting. 00:55:10 Speaker 6: They take it down to the rib. 00:55:15 Speaker 5: No, No, it's just it's a waste. I mean, it's pure waste. This is the letter of the law and that's all they care about. And I'm like, that's ridiculous. 00:55:23 Speaker 7: Gay Moarten's got to know everything about everything, and like not just at wildlife crime, but like how it goes. If you pull over someone for d UI, there got to be regular cops on top of it. Yep, be tough stuff, and then and then you know someone asks them, like, what's that bird over there? It's expected they know that as well. 00:55:43 Speaker 3: It's a huge skill set man, a lout of respect for the occupation. And also it's like a lot of those guys kind of come at it because they got a love of hunting and stuff. And then you make this commitment where you're just gonna work all through hunting season and then go up to hunters and have people be like dismissive and rude. You got to do with that all the time. 00:56:03 Speaker 5: I'm always uh paster in our game wardens, and some of them are foolish enough to give me their cell phone numbers, so I'm always calling and text them and stuff. And I was talking to one last week and he's like, yeah, I confiscated my fifth animal of the season. And I didn't really pry, but he said most of those were all self turn in people who went, oh my god, shot a buck in the wrong unit, Oh my god, didn't you know, stuff like that. 00:56:40 Speaker 4: So I've got I've got some clarification here. The the Montana Annotated Code defines for game animals excluding mountain lions, so including black bears, all of the four quarters above the hawk, including loin and backstrap, are considered suitable for. 00:56:59 Speaker 3: Food above the howk okay, then you gotta do you gotta keep the shank. 00:57:03 Speaker 7: Mm hmmmm is it saying loin or backsdromp strap, loin and backstrap, So. 00:57:11 Speaker 3: They're calling the t loin the loin because the backstrap is the loin. 00:57:16 Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, I regress apologies for saying that. I might have been wrong. Maybe it was thinking mountain lions. 00:57:22 Speaker 8: I didn't mean to interject so forcefully, but I didn't. 00:57:26 Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I didn't want to say. 00:57:29 Speaker 7: Something dude, you know, but I like that no one knew the law because it's just implied that everyone was gonna, you know, take out. Why wouldn't you take all that? 00:57:36 Speaker 5: Oh man, like all those bird carcasses too. I'm always making stock and it's not like it's I had a fella tell me straight faced at the Pheasants Forever Quail Forever Annual get together, and you're right, what you assume is just full of bird hunters tell me straight faced about shooting sage grouse in Montana, and I was like, oh my gosh, the thighs on sage grouse or something like the best meat ever. And he's like, Oh, we didn't take the legs. We didn't have enough room in the cooler. 00:58:09 Speaker 7: Come on, lunch pal. 00:58:13 Speaker 5: I don't know how to continue this conversation. 00:58:19 Speaker 3: I didn't meet this person, but a friend of there is a war. There's a trooper in Alaska. The game words of state troopers, like, there's a there's a state. There's a sort of a division of state troopers that handle wildlife, but they're within the state troopers. Someone tell me there's a there's a I know, I remember in the story. I don't remember where they worked, but they were a female state trooper who had a policy on the moose wanton waste. She would carry, as explained to me, gallon sized ziplocks. If she goes up to a moose carcass and she fills that gallon in size zip lock with good meat off the parts that need to be retained, that's her threshold interest, that's her personal threshold. When she gets a gallon sized bag of good meat, you screwed up. 00:59:13 Speaker 8: M wow. 00:59:15 Speaker 3: I like that. 00:59:16 Speaker 8: Yeah, it feels it fast. 00:59:17 Speaker 5: Yeah, especially on a moose. 00:59:20 Speaker 3: Yeah, if you were sloppy and you see you get that bag out on a moose. You're like, oh, let's just don't just don't waste time like I screwed up Saskatchewan. A Canadian wrote in, they kind of chastise us. Oh, since you have been targeting Canadian users with your on x ads, I figured perhaps you'd be interested to learn something about the challenges we have here. 00:59:48 Speaker 5: High and mighty, sitting way up north in the Rockies fair looking down on us. 00:59:54 Speaker 3: I'm gonna I want to read this letter, but I want to read this letter as a way that's not going to deliver to her what she wants. 00:59:59 Speaker 7: I'm sorry, Saskatchewan now have on x okay. I thought they were saying you target them with your No, she's. 01:00:07 Speaker 3: Saying that that if you're in Canada, you get delivered. I don't know. I don't know somehow, I don't know she's getting advertised. She just wants some Canadian coverage, just all okay. But she has the wrong idea about what goes on down here. She's writing in about this. In Saskatchewan, they have a fledgling elk curd, and they don't have a well established widespread elkkurd in the Saskatchewan. It's bull only. There are some agricultural producers who are kind of pissed at the elk. So they're opening up a cow season, a seven day cow season. Since they don't do draws, it just becomes a general seven day cow season in some of these areas. She is saying, this has nothing to do with health of the elk, herd, carrying capacity, of the landscape distribution of elk. This is simply a small number of landowners being mad about elk grazing on their property. And she goes on to say, we often look down enviously at how wildlife is managed in the USA, and I just want to say, Catlin, buddy, the city, the City on the Hill, were not. You did not. Canada did not invent depredation. It did not. Yeah, Canada did not invent the overpopulated as defined by a handful of agricultural producers. Yeah, that is a I would have said, boy, I sure wish I was, you know, or not. I don't wish that. I sure like it that Canadians don't do that, But sounds that we both have developed the same habits. 01:01:53 Speaker 7: On X announced in October twenty twenty four that they are now available in Canada, and they show a government lands. They should also show private lands, but not private land ownership. But good for Canadians. I was always under the impression they didn't have on X up there. 01:02:10 Speaker 8: They caught up with us. 01:02:11 Speaker 5: That's all you got. 01:02:14 Speaker 3: I'm happy for you. 01:02:16 Speaker 7: My hunting life would be so different without on X, and I can't it's you know, fathom not having on X until a year ago. It'd be way different. 01:02:25 Speaker 3: It would be different. You want to know how different? Can I tell you a little something. This happened to me last night? You think you're gonna think I'm making this up. On my bookshelves in my office at home, I still have all my Delorm gazzeteers. I mean I had my Delorm gazetteer collection was as wide as this laptop. Yeah. I pulled out my old, old for nostalgic purposes. I pulled out my old old Montana one from like the late nineties. I pulled that out because I used to like mark my I used to drop my pins, so to speak, by like drawing on that gazzet here. I pulled that out to put in my like keat like with my dad's war records and stuff like that, and took those and put them in a trash can and it felt naughty. But I'm like, but what are you gonna do with them? You know, like I haven't touched one of those things. I was like, Oh, you can't do that, Like what are you supposed to like? Storm? 01:03:34 Speaker 5: Like, then you die. 01:03:37 Speaker 3: I don't think. I don't think you recycle. These are full of staples and your door. I don't think you recycled those. I think you can. It's got a glossy covered metal staples. 01:03:46 Speaker 5: Well inside the not everything. Oh do you have the fancy ones with the binder and the nat GEO ones that. 01:03:54 Speaker 3: Whatever, I'll put them out. It's not so much where I put them exactly, said, I got rid of them. But then here's the thing. If you save them, you're going to die. And the first thing your kids are going to do is throw them away. 01:04:07 Speaker 7: That's the right way to look at that. 01:04:08 Speaker 5: I had an interesting phone call over the weekend from a rancher. And you know, a lot of folks are reaching out with the announcement of the incoming CEO stuff, and so I don't want to violate and you trust here, but I got a heads up and said, like there was a recent landowner meeting with Montana Fish, wildlife and parks on and you should be interested to know that there's a renewed push largely by and he was in this meeting by folks who you would call recreational. 01:04:42 Speaker 8: Ranch amenity ranchers. 01:04:45 Speaker 5: To increase the number of land owners bull elk tags for the purposes of reducing the elk hurts. And I I was thinking about that, you know, and it was doing a lot of driving over the weekend, and it kind of turns it ties into the Saskatchewan deal. But you know how cult leaders eventually get to the point where they're like, I had a vision, a dream, and I'm gonna do everyone the favor of taking on the sexual burden so nobody else that you other men don't need to worry about it exactly exactly, nobody else has sex with the women except for me. 01:05:32 Speaker 3: I'll handle it, yeah, much as I don't like. 01:05:35 Speaker 5: To, So you don't. You no longer burden with what comes with that. 01:05:41 Speaker 3: And I'm like, because I alone can handle that heavy exactly, And it's like, should that be the tactic? Here? 01:05:49 Speaker 5: Is like, thank you so much for taking on the burden of killing the bull elk, so the rest of us don't have to worry about that. 01:05:57 Speaker 3: Yeah, you're like, what I like to have was I like to have hundreds of elk move on to my place. I don't want anyone to hunt them because it might scare him away, but it does cause a lot of damage. So I would like to be able to kill a huge bowl. He seems to be eating a lot. 01:06:20 Speaker 5: Cows. 01:06:20 Speaker 3: Whenever I look out there, there he is eating. I mean he's bigger, he probably eats more. I just want to get the big one that eats the most. 01:06:31 Speaker 4: His hoofs are bigger. Yeah, he's like he travels stuff horns get tangled in barbar. 01:06:38 Speaker 3: All right, Kel gives tell us a little bit about your your grizzly hunt. 01:06:43 Speaker 5: Boy, There is so much tell It was an amazing hunt. I had been out on the Alaskan Peninsula, you know, pretty darn close to where we were this time in twenty eleven as a packer, and that was a wild experience. And we kill the giant bear that trip. We killed two killed two out of three on that season twenty eleven. 01:07:09 Speaker 3: Did you already say that? 01:07:10 Speaker 8: Yep? 01:07:11 Speaker 5: So, I mean a long long time ago now, right, But it was an extremely memorable experience because all the things that people talk about on the peninsula like crazy severe weather and very challenging and some some suffering, mostly mental. And we killed this giant brown bear and it is one of those things that I referenced because it's like we killed it a what I would call like a high school athlete, like senior high school athlete type of it's mature, but it's just getting started grizzly bear. And then we killed the like old NFL pro going downhill fast grizzly bears trying to get one more contract. And the skull in comparison, right is like oh species, subspecies really like it is just a dinosaur thing. And that was just very very impressive to me. And then also the physicality that it takes to move through that landscape fast with the muskeg and the brush and then carry out you know what is almost always a big wet hide is hard, really hard, you know. 01:08:45 Speaker 3: And duncan Gil Chris's book All about Bears, which is true classic. He mentioned some bears being so big. Have you ever seen this, some bears being so big that they cut them at the waist and haul it out. 01:08:57 Speaker 1: In two pieces? 01:08:58 Speaker 5: Yes, what don't you feel weird doing it, very weird, And have you seen that. I've never seen it, but it's always talked about. 01:09:05 Speaker 7: You feel like we've seen Klay Nukeomb maybe do that very weird. 01:09:09 Speaker 3: Yeah, the hell's here that he needs to do that. 01:09:11 Speaker 7: I don't know. That's that sounded familiar to me that if. 01:09:14 Speaker 3: He's doing he's just doing it to dramatic. It's like when he shoots, it. 01:09:22 Speaker 5: Should be a big deal because a taxidermist is going to be sewing that thing up no matter what you do with it. But at the same time, it's a really big deal. 01:09:33 Speaker 3: I've thought of it. If I needed to do it, I would. It would just feel very like really. 01:09:37 Speaker 5: Yeah, you're cut in half. Yeah, yeah, and the conditions up there like there it's there's always moisture, even on bluebird days, and the bluebird days may not even come during that season. 01:09:51 Speaker 3: What's one of those hides? Way? 01:09:54 Speaker 5: God, what was the kind of going estimate? Is like you're you're going to be in like with the skull and the hide and you know it's still got fat on and stuff because you're not fleshing it at the scene. 01:10:05 Speaker 3: Of the Yeah, paws intact yep. 01:10:08 Speaker 5: But it's going to be somewhere in that one hundred and fifty pound good god Man range and then through all that brush and everything. Yeah, and then it can it can definitely go heavier. 01:10:17 Speaker 3: Huh. Hence the cut in half. 01:10:20 Speaker 5: Yeah, so that was in mind. It's a very expensive trip, so I was like, well, one day I'll get back here. But I never thought i'd get back there to actually hunt. 01:10:33 Speaker 3: You know. 01:10:34 Speaker 5: I figured out I want to go be a packer again or guide or something. 01:10:37 Speaker 1: And and so. 01:10:41 Speaker 5: Uh, yeah, we got to do this trip, which was crazy, huge opportunity, once in a lifetime trip, and I was very like I just really wanted to maximize it. And the two guides. We had two guides instead of a guide and a packer the because it's a new area for for this outfit and they wanted to get people more experience on the ground, so we had two guides and and you know, we just kind of had a talk of like, hey, I know oftentimes people aren't like physically or mentally prepared for what this trip can be. Like trust trust me, like my crew, like we're ready to go. We can suffer. We got the mindset to be here and if we got to jog across muskeg and swamp and through brush and stuff to get it done. 01:11:34 Speaker 3: We can do it. 01:11:36 Speaker 5: And you know, it's kind of like you build up that trust with your brand new friends for the week, right, is a big part of the guidance game. And and I really wanted. I was like, I want a respectable bear with my bow first and foremost, and if I got to get one with a rifle, I want that big giant bear if they're around. And and we got in there two days early, which they really encourage, right, because the travel you never know when a travel day you're actually going to be able to fly. 01:12:14 Speaker 3: Yeah, like two day's earlier or potentially a week late exactly because the storm comes in. 01:12:19 Speaker 5: Yeah, and the the spots out there, like it's it's pretty rare to have like an area unless you're right on the beach at low tide where you can get a bigger plane in. So it's all super cub which you know, they're just limited in what they can carry and and wind and conditions and stuff like that. So everything was awesome. We came in on a beautiful blue bird day. I'm making the story way longer. We got got to see all the weather and suffer for a few days, and saw some big giant bears. I think three ultimately one was in like that like super big giant bear category, and then two were in like the big giant bear category. 01:13:08 Speaker 3: One was the outgoing NFL guy exactly. 01:13:10 Speaker 5: Yep, yeah, yeah, and we I mean we got to see him at spotted him opening morning of the hunt. So the third day that we're there, it's just barely getting light. I look across one of the rivers and here's this bear like curled up in a bed, but look in our direction and you just see like the big dish face kind of lion Maine from that profile shot or not profile head on shot. And I was like, well, look at that bear, and everybody got real excited. I was like, well, we got to make a decision quick, you know, And then ultimately went in there. The bear had gone into the brush already. Seeing them is one thing. Catching up with them another thing, Like you can't really catch up to a bear that's on a destination type walk. 01:14:05 Speaker 3: Yeah, and you're on a coastal plain. You're like, yeah, like river estuaries coming out through willow flats and all their. 01:14:11 Speaker 5: Flats yep, yeah, and the stuff that you think is like looks like a hayfield is a marsh. 01:14:17 Speaker 3: Yeah, the couple players are you're flying over, You're like, I'm gonna walk over there. I'm gonna walk over there and walk over there. And you land, You're like, man, you're walking anywhere. Yeah, you're not walking anywhere. 01:14:25 Speaker 5: Yeah, I had told you this. But like one of the most fun things is it's ultra brushy for the bears too, So they are constantly standing up on their hind feet and looking around, and I'm like prairie dogs and brown bears, So I'm like, who would have thought? Who would have thought? The similarities because they're just constantly being like, well, I better get a better look. And so it's just like dead flat, you know, is what the I relief says. And then all of a sudden, it's. 01:14:54 Speaker 3: Like, oh, he's standing there. 01:14:57 Speaker 5: Yeah, bears standing there. And then it drops on all fours and it's just totally gone to exist. Yeah, and they're falling all these little creeks side channels that have salmon still spawning up in them, so permanent snowfields behind us, Pacific Ocean out in front of us, Like I mean it's amazing. It's amazing ducks everywhere. 01:15:18 Speaker 3: Man. 01:15:19 Speaker 5: I was thinking about how the duck hunting was going here because there were so many mallards green heads still out there on the peninsula. Know what the problem is though, Pacific Flyway. 01:15:30 Speaker 3: They're eating salmon eggs. 01:15:32 Speaker 5: Yeah, no, I had no idea. 01:15:34 Speaker 3: Oh dude, it's like eating a sea monster. 01:15:36 Speaker 2: Man. 01:15:38 Speaker 5: But I was just like, boy, there's a lot of green, like full plumage mallards here, which means like the folks in the Pacific Flyway probably aren't shooting a bunch of mallards right now. Was my thought. 01:15:51 Speaker 7: Are the salmon eggs like their diet or like a part of their diet? 01:15:55 Speaker 3: Open that stuff, man, I'm not saying all, but even geese too. They eat a lot of up there to eat a lot of invertebrates, and you eat a lot of washed out salmon eggs, so you'll get their crop. We'll have salmon eggs in it. It just tastes like again, it's rugged, it's rugging. I got a bite that grew up in Southeast Alaska and he said, you know, they tried, tried eventually, just he said, you just don't eventually like you just didn't look at the ducks as like a game bird because you just couldn't get through them. And I've had the same thing every time you eat one of those saltwater estuary in that area Salmon stream ducks. It's like when you go there in September and they're all hanging out the mouth of the stream. Yeah, they're not there on accident. 01:16:42 Speaker 7: I'm surprised that works its way out of their system by the time they get to us. If it's like that pungent, Yeah, I. 01:16:48 Speaker 3: Think they burned through it quick. I don't know anyhow ducks you saw them check. 01:16:54 Speaker 5: And there were wolves on the airstrip when we flew in, really, which I immediately was like, well, we're not going to shoot a wolf this trip. I would have been my percentage wise. I'm like, if they weren't, that was my opportunity. 01:17:08 Speaker 3: I couldn't take it. Yeah. 01:17:09 Speaker 5: Yeah, And we didn't see any wolves. We did a lot of wolf howling after after we got got the bear, but got one really legit perfect stock in with the bow on a big sal and it was one of those things where you're like, oh, that's probably a sow and but it's a mature bear, no cubs. We got to watch her for miles and eventually she came like right into the airstrip and decided to take a nap. 01:17:44 Speaker 3: Is there such a thing as w NFL. 01:17:49 Speaker 5: No, Well, you could say, like a women's rugby player there you go, yeah, job, serious athletes, and they're like, man, that's it's not a bear. I'd tell you to kill one day, two or three, I can't remember what it was, but I was just like, guys, this is as close to a bird in the hand situation, and I have a bow, like I want to, we gotta go try. And so that would just worked out magically, that sal because it's like the myth of the dry sow. You never know if they are. But this looked like an old bear and she had no cubs, so math is kind of like she's too old to just be a bad mom probably and lose the cubs. And it's not like kicking cub out season type of thing. So anyway, pretty sure it was a dry sow, and very sure it was an older bear. And then when we got down there, got off the glass and knob, she started working her way towards us into the wind and we and that was one of the funny things, is like the wind was absolutely dead wrong from the glass and knob, but we had put ribbons out on the landing strip so you could see so the pilots could see the wind direction and people on the ground could call wind for the guys flying the supercubs. So you'd glass down at the ribbons and you're like, well, it's doing that down there, which was awesome. 01:19:26 Speaker 3: But man. 01:19:27 Speaker 5: Yeah, we got on the ground and I'm looking through this clump of willow out in this like nice kind of hummock of pretty hard tundra, and I'm like, oh, she's coming right right to us. And part of me thinks that she caught a whiff of us and was kind of curious because she like, you know, you were like, well, they didn't read the script. This one like read the script and was like, oh, I'm supposed to arbitrarily pick this bush where three dudes are hiding and go walk past it. And I'm like, oh holy, and they walk so fast it's deceiving right. I'm like, oh my god, this is really happening. So I range something. I jam my binoculars back and my chest back. I kind of look over my shoulder and I look and this bear's I'm like, she's going to walk at twenty yards twenty five at the furthest perfectly broadside. And about the time I think that, she just stands straight up and looks over the top of the bush at us and then drops down and spins and walks out of oh man, And I was I had enough time to be like, well, I don't really want to shoot her in the chest because I want lungs. Just kind of playing the math game. And I'm just like not comfortable with like where that heart is right there? 01:21:00 Speaker 3: Is that not a good shot for archery. 01:21:02 Speaker 5: I don't think it's a good shot. Like there's a lot of cavity there that. 01:21:06 Speaker 3: I'm standing up. I just feel like everything's on full display. Man, I know. And you're gonna have good blood because the hole is gonna be in the bottom. 01:21:12 Speaker 5: The holes in the bottom. 01:21:13 Speaker 7: And they make a lot of three D targets. 01:21:15 Speaker 5: They make a targets. 01:21:17 Speaker 3: Because that appeals to a certain human. 01:21:19 Speaker 5: Well here's something fun. I never hit those. That's what made that so. When I was at the Shields Archery University in South Dakota this year, we have that stupid target. I didn't hit it. I mean I hit it, I just didn'thit it where I was supposed to. So anyway was what you were after. But it was enough of a like she stood up and I looked at her and you could just see the scars on her face, and that was just an amazing thing. And she turns around and everybody's like, whoa, whoa. That was a hell of an experience. And she gets out there to sixty yards and I'm like trying to like mouse squeal at her, like. 01:21:57 Speaker 3: Trying to make kiss yes and trying to like get. 01:22:00 Speaker 5: Her to stop. And she stops at sixty and like looks back at us and just does this full mouth, sleepy ass yawn tongue all the way out and then turns and just cruises on. I was like, well, it wasn't a heart thumping moment for her, obviously, so uh, but that was just super cool. 01:22:26 Speaker 3: She didn't think it was super cool to see you guys. 01:22:30 Speaker 5: Like her. Her pulse didn't quicken. She's just like sit, stood up, looked over the top. So that was cool. And then yeah, we just got like pummeled with rain and wind and we were underneath the tart for like thirteen hours, and right at dark, the it like light lightens up a little bit, so it's like misty rain instead of like full on nasty ran birds start blowing up in the side channel where we had seen the big bear opening morning. 01:22:58 Speaker 3: That tells you one stern in there. 01:22:59 Speaker 5: Yeah, exactly, yep. Like so the seagulls start. 01:23:02 Speaker 3: Is it the bears spooking the goals or the goals follow the bear. 01:23:05 Speaker 5: I think it's the goals are because at this point you could tell from all the salmon carcasses they're not eating fish. They're eating the brain and they're ripping out the. 01:23:16 Speaker 3: So the birds hang out to get the all the eggs that. 01:23:19 Speaker 5: Are flying around, and when you're walking on those streams, you know, it just smells like ultra death rancid and there's eggs everywhere, and. 01:23:29 Speaker 3: That's a very hard smell to be around for days. Oni. 01:23:31 Speaker 7: Yeah, Yeah, they just go for the brain. 01:23:34 Speaker 5: So early in the season, when the fish start coming in, they'll eat the whole fish. And then as the land of plenty occurs, they're like laying on the bank, like snagging the ones that they want as they come by, and they're they're searching out these zones. We saw some amazing bear fishing activity, but they're searching out these zones where it's like the easiest possible things like the side channels where the fish are going through skinny water. 01:24:03 Speaker 3: And I've seen black bears duke it out over who gets to be in the sweet spot and aligne form a line form where like you come out, they take their turn, the big mean one gets what it's after, and then the next guy runs out to try to get a minute in the spot. 01:24:22 Speaker 5: Yeah, and you know, I was like, well, this isn't a good idea because we're going to be in a situation where we don't like get to judge like it's it's gonna be really quick if it happens. It's it's getting dark, it's foggy. I grabbed the rifle and we trucked out out there, because you also just want to move and do something at the end of thirteen hours in the rain underneath the tire preak. Yeah, and everybody did. So we go out there, stand on this gravel bar. It's like a fifteen minute walk from camp, and we're looking and immediately you're like, yeah, we're not gonna be able to see anything like two hundred yards. It's like foggy and stuff in that side channel. And again like I want to, like, if I'm gonna shoot it with the rifle, I want to be a big ass bear. And I'm like, we kind of do a little wrap up scene and I'm like, all right this, and then let's go go back to the shack and we take like five steps and then all this crashing and water splashing, and here comes this cow moose charging across the river right in front of us, stops at forty yards. She's huffing and puffing and blowing and her eyeballs are crazy, and her head's on a swivel, and she sees us and she's panicked, and then trucks back across the river. And the guy's like she's getting chased by a bear, Like, ah, yeah, maybe, And so I kind of recount that to dirt Meth. Garrett Smith's around the camera. I'm like, hey, this is what happened. And now we're we're really heading back and then splashing and crashing, and I look and here comes this brown bear trucking across the river. And so at this point I got around in the chamber and both guides are there too, right, like, there's a three seventy five here and a three seventy five on both my shoulders. Garrett's behind us. The bear comes ripping across the river, same deer deal, crashing and water flying, and it hits that spot where the cow moose was standing. And at this point, Kyle on my right hand side is going, it's your call, it's your call, it's your call. And I'm like, okay, like this isn't like the bear I want with a rifle. And I'm like, I'm ready in case things get crazy serious, but I mean it is realistically, it's plenty serious. It's forty yards like they can move fast, you know. And that bear kind of like drops its shoulder and turns its head, and Brando on my left goes, you. 01:27:10 Speaker 3: Better shoot every barth. 01:27:13 Speaker 1: And you know, I'm like. 01:27:17 Speaker 5: God, and I shoot and the bear dives into the brush. Kyle shoots one more time, and now I'm like, okay, now we got a situation on our hands. Like I know I thumped this bear. I'm pretty sure Kyle got another shot in there too, But it's in this like now it's dark and it is in this just dripping wet alder hell hell hole. But we heard a death mone right then too. But I mean it's fifteen twenty yards type of distance, and your headlamp is very necessary but at the same time as just like reflecting light back at you. So you're kind of like doing this. 01:28:03 Speaker 3: Like thing that moisture. 01:28:06 Speaker 5: Yeah, and you got your guns out right, and it is like it's foggy and crappy and the whole thing. And I'm like, okay, guys, it's like, got guns, it's dark, got a bear in here, Like what's our plan? And we start easing into this thing and blood trailing and I can tell Garrett Smith's having no fun at all. 01:28:30 Speaker 3: That made Dirt nervous. 01:28:32 Speaker 5: He told me, he goes cal I was scared. It's like, okay, good to know. And and then yeah, here's this bear piled up in there and dead dead yeah, which was which was great, but it was you know, like it's in a just a total willow hole and h then you're thinking about all the other bears around, because we had seen so many bears that it's not like this is the one. Well, that day that we flew in was the first break in the weather in like the entire peninsula season, including moose. And you know, I had friends up there too, like Adam and Brenda Weatherby were up there and they had a horrific time weather wise for moose season which just ended, and then brown bear season starts and there's a little gap in between. And so this was like the first nice day and we probably saw thirty bears and I would say probably like seventeen ish unique bears, Like there were a lot of cow soals and cubs running around that day. 01:29:43 Speaker 3: But like. 01:29:45 Speaker 5: You very fast got the impression like, oh my god, this is a high density bear situation, right, because they're not spread out, because the the salmon spawning activity happens like in a relatively small area, and the river and the creeks really aren't that long, right. It's like you can see the glacial snow situation up here, and the Pacific's right here. It's like you can hike to the head the very headwater in a hard day, you know, from from the ocean. So it's a pretty concentrated situe compressed. Yeah, So you know, I I really think safety wise, like totally made the right call. You don't get that much time to decide and things can change right away. But as I said, I was like, there's no such thing as almost getting charged. So I don't want anybody saying we almost got charged. It's like he almost you do or you don't. That's that's all. 01:30:50 Speaker 3: That's all unless you interview the bear. 01:30:53 Speaker 5: You can interview the bear. And he was like, oh, I was coming after. 01:30:56 Speaker 3: Your ass changed my mind at the last minute, almost charged you. 01:30:59 Speaker 5: Yeah, exactly. Yeah, But it's not like that big giant bear that was like the ultimate goal or the or the bear with the bow. But it is a totally badass animal and and very very appreciative of the experience and and everything. And and I did some cooking in camp for those guys, and you know, big stigma around those bears. The meat, I thought the meat was very good. The context really does matter, like meat in camp, when everybody is just coated in grizzly bear fat that smells like fish, and then the the clean error outside of you and the human stank and the bear stank is decaying fish and just general decay. It's called the miasma kind of kind of taints your taste buds. 01:32:00 Speaker 3: Everything tastes like a rotten fish. 01:32:02 Speaker 5: Yeah, but but I think the I think the bear is good. The bear is good. And I cleaned up all that meat when I got at home. 01:32:11 Speaker 3: Can you can you give me a chunk of the meat. 01:32:13 Speaker 8: Yeah? 01:32:14 Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, So I got a brisket and front shoulder and a hind quarter and then we left. 01:32:22 Speaker 8: And the tongue and a tongue, yeah, I'll pass on that. 01:32:24 Speaker 3: I just want the meat. I just want to try the meat. 01:32:27 Speaker 5: It's a different type of tongue too. 01:32:28 Speaker 8: You can imatin. 01:32:29 Speaker 5: It's like a it's like a big dog tongue. 01:32:32 Speaker 3: I'm like a want yeah, yeah, you. 01:32:37 Speaker 7: Do want to over ask take his one tongue. 01:32:39 Speaker 3: I just want a nice little I want like like a just I want to have the fishy bears. I want to have the like fall fish bear, brown bear chunk of meat, not an odd ball cutting right. Yeah, I don't want. 01:32:53 Speaker 5: I will tell you that the difference between the spring bears, the two that I've been around for the hiding and fleshing, and this fall bear is like it would have taken like some fortitude to be like, Okay, I'm gonna cut off some big chunks of meat off this spring bear and cook it and eat it because it's a totally different animal. Like what I saw and on that spring hunt is like they're they're emaciated. That fat is not white, it's like yellow and kind of hard, and they and the smell is way way more just generally rancid. It's like an ultra concentrated rotten fish. And then the the freshnet like immediately like you're looking at the fat, You're like, oh, that's beautiful. You look the meat, You're like, the meat is beautiful, and then you just kind of have like this different smell to deal with. Ye I made, you know, it's like that guard piece of meat. But I'm sure it has a real name on the front shoulder that you know, he typically just throwing the grind pile. When I was cleaning that up back here, I just took that and sliced it real thin and made a stir fry, and I thought it was like fantastic. Really, I did not put fish sauce in my in my sturfry, and he just kind of like, you know, just a preemptive step. But I thought, yeah, fantastic, And I fed it to folks at the at the Baja office, and I will tell you like people were like, Oh, that's great, and then some people were like, I would like the Sturfry sauce recipe, not the grizzly bear recipe. So yeah, hell of a trip, hell of a trip. 01:34:47 Speaker 3: Kind of jealous of that? 01:34:49 Speaker 5: You should be? You should be, I mean, but it is definitely just not Jason Rarick was on that trip, right, so he doesn't do a lot of those types of adventures. And and I are going to do a little recap podcast on that because I really want his two cents. 01:35:04 Speaker 3: You know. 01:35:05 Speaker 5: It's just like not a recreational spot, right, Like even the Alaska Natives and the Alaskans, they don't like go out there just to hang out. It's like a purpose driven destination, you know. So it it like it's a harsh environment. Yeah, yeah, thanks for the report. Yeah, it turned out longer than I thought it would be, but it's great. 01:35:34 Speaker 3: I didn't tell you guys about did I did? I Were we recording when I tease the Tony Peters some white tailed deer thing? 01:35:41 Speaker 8: No, but you asked us to ask you about it? 01:35:44 Speaker 3: Oh can you ask me? 01:35:45 Speaker 4: Yeah, what was the thing you said about you were going to say earlier about Tony Peterson, but then didn't say. 01:35:51 Speaker 5: Said ask me about talking? 01:35:55 Speaker 8: Does he not care about Well? 01:35:56 Speaker 3: No, I've hunted white tales with Tony Peterson two times now, Okay, I hunted public ground in Oklahoma with Tony Peterson, and I hunted private ground in Nebraska with Tony Peterson. Tony Peterson has an amazing ability to determine where a buck is gonna step hmm, meaning the kind of what I picked up fro him. The difference from when I was a kid bow hunting white tails of Michigan before I moved away. You would like we would optimize growing up. You would optimize for like, where would I be to see a lot of deer activity? Because if I'm seeing a lot of deer activity, then it seems to me like there's a greater chance that one will come by. Right. That dude sets up to have with one objective in mind. It's where will you have a buck twenty yards away broadside? Nothing else matters. He will set you up where you can't see a patch or ground bigger than that muskox hide. But he is like a buck will come and stand in front of that muskox hide, and they do, and they do It's like he has got a phenomenal sense of like, you know, wind whatever, how they're gonna travel, when they're gonna travel, where they're gonna come from, they're gonna come from the right, whatever. It just it's like it's kind of uncanny, just and it's it's like it's myopic. You know, it's where where where will he be? Twenty yards away broadside. 01:37:48 Speaker 7: My elevator pitch for Tony. I've worked with dozens of like professional, really good whitetail hunters. I've interviewed hundreds of them from working at outdoor magazines and hosting Wired to Hunt r redfresh Tony is the best public land bowhunter I've ever met. I just like, don't think there's many people better than him on the continent. It's like special what he can do when you know, starting at e scouting and then showing up there in person and just killing a buck. You know, very few people can do it like him. 01:38:19 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's I kind of like I start to kind of see, like I kind of get what he's looking at. We're hunting my neighbor, and my neighbor even said to me after he goes, man, what do you like? What what would we have done? What do you think would have happened with? What would we have done? I said, I don't know, man, we would like I don't hunted scrapes, but I know whatever, like a lot of tracks here, yeah, or probably would been like yeah, sit here because you can see what's going on or whatever. It's just it's funny. He just like doesn't care about anything other than like where is the spot where the buck And then the other thing he's just dogmatic about is he's got his north wind spots, his south wind spots, his east wind spots, his western spots, his southeast wind spots, and there's in that that is determinative. H Like, there is no you, there's no room in his mind for like wishful thinking like well, you know the wind's not great, but you know, you get into that little child like you know where you want, you know where you want to be so bad marginal wind and then the winds like kind of off. But some part you're like, well the wind's bad, but it's not so bad that it doesn't like make up for the good. It's just done. Yeah, you don't even talk about that spot. You don't talk about that spot unless the wind is absolutely perfect for that spot. You don't even look at it on the map. It's not an option. 01:40:03 Speaker 5: Back when I was in my Archriol Guidan days, I would have a talk with with my guests my clients on setting up in spots. You don't want to set up in a spot where you can view nature, because but I kind of do, because you is to kill nature. Like you need to set up in a spot where you're going to kill nature, not view nature. 01:40:29 Speaker 7: That's the thing you have to like fight when you are deciding where to sit. 01:40:32 Speaker 3: And I would curse him. I'd get up because he had gone to set stands and I get there, like, oh my god, it's such a Tony Peterson spot. Like you can't see a thing. You can't see a thing, and you better be ready. Yeah, you see it going. 01:40:52 Speaker 7: Something those guys have in common is like they haunt a lot of spots that are top pinned territory. Were like, you know, you wouldn't there's no scenario where you'd need to look at your second pin. 01:41:01 Speaker 3: On the bow. Oh yeah, he's not talking about sneaking one in at forty. It's like he wants deer in your lap. Yeah, yeah, no, I get it. The spots he set up, Yeah, you're not. You don't get up and like starts range finding different things. It's like, dude, you're like, if you want range, find some stuff at the outer edge of your view. It's like twenty two yards, twenty two yards, twenty three yards? 01:41:24 Speaker 5: What what height? 01:41:27 Speaker 3: Low? No way that kills me. M Yeah, his setups are low interesting and he could have the world's greatest tree ten feet away. But it's not like he like a great where you'd be like watching, Yeah you did watching ducks out in the slew, you know whatever, you're like ten feet over that way. He doesn't care, dude, he doesn't care. 01:41:52 Speaker 7: What is Tony bad at? Because you had you observe something, Oh okay, enjoying the He's not making a nature documentary. 01:42:02 Speaker 3: He's bad at wildlife viewing. We're not bad at him. Just he likes birds and stuff. But no, he's not. His setups aren't meant to be that. It's a great place to hang out. But dude, I like, after we went, you know, we got like a buck on day one, we got a buck on day two, we got a buck on day four. They're all twenty yard shots, all twenty yard shots all broad side, And after that, I was like, I get it, I get it. 01:42:31 Speaker 7: I haven't seen it, because that's. 01:42:32 Speaker 5: A pretty good success for Yeah. 01:42:35 Speaker 7: I haven't seen the deer you and your neighbor killed, but I saw the one Tony killed, a very nice one. What what were those deer like? 01:42:43 Speaker 3: At eight points? They went progressively smaller? My neighbor got a nice one, you know, like a nice like wow, I'll show you a picture of mine. It's like a like an eight an ear wide shorter timed eight. 01:42:57 Speaker 7: Very efficient kill three bucks in four days. 01:43:00 Speaker 5: Yeah, And then does Tony entertain at all, like on a trip like that when you go you know what I would entertained? 01:43:09 Speaker 3: Like stuff. 01:43:12 Speaker 8: Advertisers before dinner? 01:43:15 Speaker 3: You give him. 01:43:17 Speaker 5: Like you know what I would have done? 01:43:19 Speaker 3: Oh? You not interested? 01:43:22 Speaker 5: He's like, you're not, You're so marble below on my level. 01:43:25 Speaker 3: Yeah, But I I like defer because because I would, I just openly defer to him in that space. You know, if we're doing something like you know, if we're doing other kinds of things, I wouldn't you know, like there's other outdoor activities where I might not care. 01:43:43 Speaker 8: At already be dismissive and hostile to know. 01:43:46 Speaker 3: I'm like, hey, what do you think? What do you think? Because I just I appreciate his way of looking at things. So he was in the driver's seat. He was in the driver's seat. He knew that I have a preference for trees over being underground, and I'd say, if it's sixes, I like to be in a tree. And he that probably like factor didn't do his head a little bit. Yeah, but it's so funny, dude, Like the one I got came from there, came from the direction. It came from the direction he imagined it coming from on the trail. He imagined it walking on Uh. I remember even saying like talking about at that tight, when it's that tight, like trying to get your bow back. He's like, oh, this time of year is so distracted. You know. I see it coming, and I'm I'm not gonna draw till he's underneath me. I just catch him coming like from the right. You hear him or see him first? No, didn't. It was pretty windy. Didn't see it. Didn't didn't hear him see him? Like here he is. He just put he's like ten steps away from being underneath me. I remember, and I was just standing there ready, sorry, seated, ready, but I could shoot that way seated, And where did the deer stop? Well, I was like, it was so tight. I'm like, there's no way to get my bow back. He's gonna stop when I draw, so I'm not to draw. So he's in my pocket and he gets in my pocket and draw and I draw, and somehow miraculously he doesn't see me draw, which I couldn't believe. So then I just made a little But I was already I was for a minute entertaining the idea. He's walking so like, kind of slow with his nose on the ground. I was entertained for a minute just shooting like that. 01:45:21 Speaker 8: Dude. 01:45:21 Speaker 3: It's like it's like right where, right where? Yeah, right on the edge of what I could see. Now, It's cool. He's got like a it's a cool skill set, man, it's a cool skill set. All those years, like we would when I was, you know, twelve year old whatever, I'll you know, hunting to be like you'd set up you know, they'd be like the field, you always see the deer, and so you'd hunt a tree in the corner because the deer always walk him around out in that field and then you'd sit there and they'd not come out under you. But you got to watch them all night, you know. And if you like ran a thing like a math problem and be like, Okay, I'm here in my tree. This is a you know, a thirty acre field, thirty acre l f alfa field. I'm in my tree. I can shoot a little twenty yard circle around me. And I'm only just planning on one walking out in the field and meandering over my way. And then you realize the deer in your area have a thing where they like trot to the middle of the alfalfa field because they're so tuned in the fact that like the edge sucks, Like when you're on the edge, some kid shoots an arrow at you. But if you run out in the middle, nothing bad. Ever. 01:46:34 Speaker 7: Generations of deer know that. 01:46:35 Speaker 5: Yeah. 01:46:36 Speaker 3: Yeah, Mom's like no, no, no, don't hang out in especially that. 01:46:39 Speaker 8: Black cherry, especially the trees, the big straight trees. 01:46:42 Speaker 3: Yeah, the big cherry tree that the people are always in. Just run out and feed all you want. They can't reach you with their arrows. 01:46:48 Speaker 5: My one tree stand white tail experience was in Minnesota, and it was the scene deer that I hated because I was like, I'm stuck in this stupid tree. Deer out there. 01:47:03 Speaker 3: Yeah, I always felt like you're doing something right if you're looking at him. Yeah, Tony feels like you're doing something right. 01:47:10 Speaker 4: When he's twenty yards away, he'd be like, we were watching deer all night, just didn't get a shot. 01:47:16 Speaker 8: Okay, but you might as well have been another state. 01:47:18 Speaker 3: You came close, huh felt close? Wasn't close. 01:47:21 Speaker 8: They just didn't want to cooperate. 01:47:23 Speaker 7: Yeah, Tony's good at thinking about it, but then he also works really hard to like, you don't. You don't get that success without both of those things, because it's a lot of work just to go hang a tree stand And then if you're you're hunting for every wind with three guys, how many stands did you have hung? 01:47:38 Speaker 3: Ten we had, he had a natural blind. He had maybe four pop ups, five six trees. 01:47:48 Speaker 7: That's a lot of work. 01:47:49 Speaker 3: That's a ton of work, man. Yeah, listen, I was at his. It was basically like it was basically we were hanging out, you know, but it was basically the treatment you would like. It's exceeded the treatment you would get were you to hire an outfitter. Sure, well we brought to the table, is my This is my neighbor's family's my neighbor's family's farm. So he's like, they kind of didn't need you. Oh I didn't bring anything to the table. You weren't entertain me. No, they well, they didn't need me for anything. I was just there hanging out having a good time. It was impressive. He's cool. He's cool. It's cool to watch him hunt those white tails. 01:48:30 Speaker 7: Yeah, if you want to think, like Tony hosts the Wired to Hunt Foundations podcast, and what I love about that is they're like fifteen minute episodes, so you can go and you can knock out a whole bunch of them. And you know see how a really good white tail public land bow hunter like him thinks. 01:48:44 Speaker 3: What's funny too, is once he gets it, he ceases to care about the deer. You know what I'm saying. He just saw us off the skull plate. He's just throw it into a pile. Yeah. But once he's got it, it's like that he doesn't fetishize the antlers. I mean, they're just like it has become like another one for the pile. He likes the hunt. Dude, you know what I mean. He likes the hunt. 01:49:07 Speaker 8: Huh. 01:49:07 Speaker 3: Yeah, He's not like, oh, these are going to go on a special corner, you know, in the old mantel piece. What are you gonna do with those? Put them in my pile antlers? 01:49:18 Speaker 4: What I like about Tony if we're all doing this, He's just a very funny man, just a very sarcastic funny man. 01:49:24 Speaker 3: He's very interested in the outer space. 01:49:26 Speaker 8: Oh yeah, we were talking about that when we went fishing. 01:49:28 Speaker 3: Not in a weird way. 01:49:29 Speaker 6: He wears that tinfoil hat from time to time. 01:49:31 Speaker 3: No, no, no, no, you think so what I was warned about him originally, Mark Kenyon warned me about him in outer space. Yeah. I thought it was going to be like like aliens, like a bunch of hoodoo jibber, But it was he bombarded me with like legit outer space stuff like how far away is this? How fast is that? How dark that is? You know? We went not like not like getting attacked by aliens. 01:49:59 Speaker 4: At Yeah, we went fishing and I had just finished reading the right stuff and for whatever reason, space came up and he was like, yeah, I'm big on that. 01:50:10 Speaker 5: Yeah, Space. 01:50:10 Speaker 4: I was like, what do you mean it's a big space guy, and it was like I was hitting. It was like a infielding practice where I was hitting grounders with what I knew and he was just grabbing it and throwing me out. 01:50:22 Speaker 3: At first, me and him shared my camper. He was over around the one of my kids beds camper. 01:50:29 Speaker 7: A good guest at BET. 01:50:30 Speaker 3: He brought a couple two three space books with him. He had his space books laid out, not deer books. 01:50:36 Speaker 8: Fascinating, fascinating. 01:50:38 Speaker 5: The first thing he did when he laid down was put those stick on stars and plant little mobile. 01:50:46 Speaker 3: I'm gonna get him a sign and says there's no box in space. There you go. Might turn him off on the whole subject. I don't know. He's gonna find space, pinch points in space. 01:50:56 Speaker 4: Yeah, it is the opposite of everything that you've just described so far. What is just the interest in the infinite? And as a deer hunter, he's, oh, it's. 01:51:07 Speaker 3: A great point. Yeah. Maybe his setups all have a great view of the sky and I've failed to know, but none of them. Reviewing in my head, you can't see the sky either, huh. 01:51:18 Speaker 8: You just see a hole in front of Maybe the good readings the reading light is good. 01:51:23 Speaker 5: I was we're so pro white tail right now. 01:51:28 Speaker 1: I was just thinking. 01:51:30 Speaker 5: I was over at a friend's house, went downstairs to used the by ath, never been there before, went downstairs, used used the bathroom, and there's like many respectable white tails on the wall. And I came back up and I'm like, oh my god, there's a lot of a lot of white tail down there. And he just goes, yeah, says something about Montana. I can't kill a big mule there anymore, so you just end up with a white tail. 01:51:58 Speaker 3: Sure. 01:52:00 Speaker 5: It was like, huh, A lot of people would be real excited about it with those bucks on the wall. 01:52:06 Speaker 8: Yeah. 01:52:07 Speaker 7: And he's got a basement, Like I don't know people in Montana. 01:52:10 Speaker 5: With basements, so that's interesting. 01:52:12 Speaker 3: Yeah. 01:52:12 Speaker 7: Well, I grew up in a place where everyone had a basement, and then I came out here. And when we moved here, before we bought our house, we had looked at like twenty of them when we came out, not a single one had a basement in it. It's because of well, Tornado. The ground is extra rocky in the valley here, so that complicates it a little bit. And then I think the earthquakes. Also, they don't want to put a basement in. 01:52:38 Speaker 3: We have a we have a full footprint crawl space six feet no, five and a half feet deep, so you can't stand up in it. And I realized after a while, like, I guess if you went whatever you do normally, yeah, nine feet, you'd be standing in two feet of water. Yeah. Yeah, so it's like that deeper. I'm like, what kind of lazy ass scraped off the extra space so I can stand up now when I'm sorting through my wife's Christmas decoration. 01:53:09 Speaker 7: I should have consulted you. 01:53:10 Speaker 3: Mm hmm, well I think I know why. All right, Thanks guys, and somebody needs to add thanks Phil Spencer got thanks Phil. He doesn't want to talk about it. Where is that buck? I see it? 01:53:24 Speaker 7: Uh, he's getting taxidermy. 01:53:26 Speaker 3: You're getting them taxed her just a year amount. Why did you say tax ermys? 01:53:31 Speaker 7: Because I took it to a taxidermist to do that. 01:53:33 Speaker 8: Really, what what'd you think? 01:53:37 Speaker 7: You brought it to a tax nervous Well, our girl Brooklyn who works here, who like gives us whole a knight's discount? Yeah, of course I take it to her. 01:53:43 Speaker 3: Oh that's who you had to do it. Yes, Oh that's all I was gonna complain about that. 01:53:47 Speaker 7: I didn't take it to Brooklyn. Oh yeah, she's quick and cheap. 01:53:52 Speaker 3: I've been sending her some business too. Shes a nice job. 01:53:55 Speaker 8: Yeah, they're very clean, evenly colored. 01:54:00 Speaker 5: I took a bunch of stuff that's just been sitting around tour this year. But I did not take the brown Bear tour. 01:54:08 Speaker 3: You can get it beatled because I want to get a beat That's what I did my boys, black Bear, my boys first BlackBerry got a beatle for him. So the So it's real nasal cavity is and real sound, you know. 01:54:17 Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, what'd you think of that? Camper loved it? Oh good, I think it's enormous. 01:54:25 Speaker 3: Oh we put stabilizer bars on it. With that big diesel truck. You don't even know what's back there. Space It's is nice. Me and Tony shared it. He felt like he was an outer space. He had. 01:54:36 Speaker 8: That's a space ship. 01:54:39 Speaker 3: All right, Thanks Phil, his little his little line. Phil just let us go. 01:54:45 Speaker 5: I thought we were done. 01:54:46 Speaker 3: I want you guys to hear Phil's British accident that he forthfathing in it. No hit, how you like to do it, phil, Isn't it okay? 01:54:56 Speaker 1: Uh? 01:54:56 Speaker 2: The last time I did that, I was admonished. And then you came in here and said that our actors aren't real artists. And now you're asking me to as your court jester, to start spitting. 01:55:06 Speaker 3: Off line the boys with a crash it line. 01:55:10 Speaker 1: God bless us everyone. 01:55:13 Speaker 7: That this comes out December fifteen. Can you do something Christmas Eve? 01:55:16 Speaker 3: Though? Is that? Is that not? 01:55:18 Speaker 1: I mean, that's that's as Christmas as a gift. 01:55:20 Speaker 7: And they're like a merry Christmas in there? 01:55:21 Speaker 3: Someone oh do like where he's trying to tell Scrooge he should go home early because it's Christmas Eve. 01:55:28 Speaker 2: Well, well, Scrooge ass if i'd like the whole day, And then I say, well, if quite convenient, sir, and then he says it's not convenient, and it's not fair. That's screw that's my Scrooge. And then I said, well, it's it's Christmas Day, so it's only once a year. And then he says, well, fine, you have to come in two hours early tomorrow, and then I say, yes, sir, marry oh, I mean good evening. That's how the scene is. Thanks Menser, Pi. 01:55:57 Speaker 3: Yeah, I take back. 01:55:58 Speaker 5: That was art guy from Ireland right in and congratulate me on the the b h A position, and he said, are we still going? He said, I'm chuffed, I'm still I'm still Spencer. 01:56:11 Speaker 3: Spencer's done. 01:56:13 Speaker 8: I didn't I didn't realize we're still going. 01:56:14 Speaker 3: Earlier took his off and he's still talking. 01:56:16 Speaker 5: I just thought that was funny. Yeah, chuffed, And I was like, well, thank you all. Have to look up, look up what that is. 01:56:22 Speaker 3: Chuffed. 01:56:23 Speaker 5: It just means like you're excited, you're hand chuffed. 01:56:25 Speaker 3: I'm gonna start using that. That's like when I learned, uhlans go bouch when a gun goes off instead of bang. I'm gonna start doing chuff. 01:56:34 Speaker 6: Close to chafed though its opposite of just. 01:56:36 Speaker 5: Kind of fun to hear about Spencer's But I still can't believe. 01:56:39 Speaker 8: I can't understand if we're recording this podcast. 01:56:42 Speaker 3: No, it's over. It's over, Spencer. I would like to see your buck. 01:56:45 Speaker 7: Well, we have radio Live this week. Steve is there, meet Randall's there, we'll talk about it. 01:56:50 Speaker 3: Then that sounds good? 01:56:51 Speaker 8: How about that? 01:56:52 Speaker 3: Yeah? 01:56:52 Speaker 1: Thank you everybody, Thank you, Phil, great bother